I've a wee bit of a suggestion for dailycredits and org credits in regards to designs after getting some feedback on them and seeing how they work in the first year or so.
First having a design approved should give 1 tick of your daily credit rewards if this is possible to do.
Secondly I really think org cartels should count for getting org points on designs.
I really like these two points and I can't see any real downside to it so just wanted to throw them out as ideas if anyone agrees or disagrees.
May not have counted everything totally right but I think every achievement in total is about 10,870 lessons and 10,765 credits. (Obs not saying everyones going to get all that of course some of them are kinda insane and would take ages to farm up)
Can you split out the stuff that takes a long time to complete (I am assuming akin to our bard/scholar/pilgrim/power quest where you are limited to 500 days minimum)?
Stuff that is excessive grinding can still be included in the main (like our 100k influences / kills).
I think I did our 10k vermin in under a week, iirc. So it is worth having those around for comparison, but trimming things which simply cannot be done in a couple of weeks even grinding 24/7 is good.
Plundering and raiding for example are sort of time locked.
Caravan once every 5ish hours so you can only get a limited number of plunders in. Raids I can't actually remember how often you can do them but it costs generator power to start an official raid. Really not sure how often but I think an org may struggle to do more than a raid every day but I really don't know for certain on that one.
The ones that say kill such and such x times are obviously time restricted in re spawn times with different ones having different times. Could not tell you what the repop times are for each boss guy. Some off the achievement named mobs to kill are soloable some require a group.
Fishing is something I never did so no clue about it.
Some things are admin controlled. Gemhunts would be sort of our version of hamster hunts so you can only get them credits if an admin pop's a hunt.
Leylines switching technically isn't time locked itself but practically it is. It needs shards and you gather shards from a shardfall which is a conflict event roughly every 5ish hours. So you need to harvest shards and use them to flip leylines. Pretty much treat the leylines as a timelocked event for the sake of a compare though. Shard achievements are time locked for the same reason.
Relics are kind of soft time locked because of their drop rate.
I mean some things are time restricted like bashing 100,000 mobs is going to take you a long while but you could in theory bash 24/7 but you know what i mean.
I've a wee bit of a suggestion for dailycredits and org credits in regards to designs after getting some feedback on them and seeing how they work in the first year or so.
First having a design approved should give 1 tick of your daily credit rewards if this is possible to do.
Secondly I really think org cartels should count for getting org points on designs.
I really like these two points and I can't see any real downside to it so just wanted to throw them out as ideas if anyone agrees or disagrees.
I'd really, really like to second seeing org cartels counting for points as well, even if it's at a reduced rate.
I've been on board with org cartel cartel designs awarding points, though I do agree it should be to a lesser degree. Another thought I had was a 'completion' bonus for a cartel. Let me explain.
1) 3 public designs that can award 15 points max
2) 3 cartel designs that can award 10 points max (can change, just example)
3) All 6 design slots approved in a year awards 5 points (can change, just example)
Would make it so that if you have an empty kind of cartel, inactivate trademaster, whatever the reason, you could effectively make up for their absence or slack via submissions completely from one source.
I'll only speak for me personally, but I believe it should be lesser because it's not a -visible- design to the world. Hard to explain I guess, but lets pretend we're talking works of art. Which ones do you know about? The ones on display/exhibit or the ones that are quietly to themselves that only a few can appreciate? If that makes sense, I think that is where we are coming from, but I can be wrong.
I kinda get where your coming from. With org only designs it's kind of a public item to the extent that anyone in that org can make it and the org points are sort of, to me anyway, about our org vs your org.
So its like ok our peoples made 20 crazy good designs this year that only we can make, ain't we great, suck it other orgs woo points for us
I'll only speak for me personally, but I believe it should be lesser because it's not a -visible- design to the world. Hard to explain I guess, but lets pretend we're talking works of art. Which ones do you know about? The ones on display/exhibit or the ones that are quietly to themselves that only a few can appreciate? If that makes sense, I think that is where we are coming from, but I can be wrong.
That was the purpose behind my request for lesser points earlier. I feel like they should get some recognition, but you get more for fully public stuff. That way if you think it is at all publicly appropriate, put it there (hooray more designs for everyone!), but you still get something by not cluttering public designs with a thousand Crow-feather odd and ends (crow feathers are a bit hard for non-Glomfolk to acquire, after all).
They are!? I thought I was supposed to sneak up on you and just pluck one from your rear! Teasing aside, perhaps if this gets implemented, we could make the public ones require them not to have org-specific materials? Or at least ones that would require you to trespass etc etc etc. Would that be agreeable to folks?
I don't know that it needs to be Official Policy, but it should be encouraged to keep limited stuff used for the org(s) with access. I already find design searching tedious enough!
PS if we are encouraging more designs can we please finally get that envoy report for an in-game catalogue so I can stop using OOC Pastebin? When crafting is best done via OOC mediums it is not conducive to a pleasant experience for anyone, and more public designs just means even more work for updating your own catalogue if you are a truly brave soul who has been trying valiantly to do so.
The envoy report was basically: Give bookbinders a catalogue craftable. The bookbinder sells it to a craftsperson (gets their mark on it).
That craftsperson gives it to a customer who uses it and gets design prompts as if they were the craftsperson (so you can see their stuff and drill down into details). Puts all the searching and time into the hands of the person who wants to buy something instead of the crafter constantly dumping items a handful at a time onto Pastebin.
I think the report is a couple years old at this point but I still really want it!
Could be worth redoing it in the new envoy format?
I think the report is still open as a known accepted report, I brought it up during the last summit iirc. One of the admin said they'd look at it again, but obviously time has been tight.
Okay... here is a pastebin of Lusternia's achievements.
On this one I purged everything that was instant XP or an XP bonus. Only things that give credits or lessons were kept. I will do a side-by-side comparison, but, there's a hugely noticeable difference even at just a quick glance.
2,448 of those lessons and 918 of those credits are gated behind the gathering of pilgrims/scholars/bards/power quests over the course of 500 RL days. Edit: The other 140 credits are from offering esteem. So the only credits are gated behind hugely time-consuming things.
If you trim the grindy things (bards/scolars/pilgrims/powerquests/esteem) Lusternia gives:
@Estarra All right. Imperian's system appears to give out a maximum total of:
12,990 lessons, and 13,755 credits.
vs. Lusternia's maximum of 2,713 lessons, 1,058 credits (and again, if you take out our 500-day grind quests, Lusternia just gives 265 lessons and that's all).
Breakdown of Imperian's seems to be (note that this was basically me trying to group things up, I'll pastebin the achieves with a category heading so you can see my breakdown):
Newbie achievements (stuff that I think anyone should be able to figure out relatively easily in a short period of time, some grinding probably involved-- there are some pretty easy ones in other categories that give things like 50 lessons/credits, such as the PvP area. Could get a friend for those pretty easily too).
1465 lessons.
Arena achievements:
700 lessons, 3300 credits.
World Event achievements:
845 lessons, 2445 credits.
Long-term / Lifetime achievements:
5790 lessons, 2325 credits.
PvP achievements:
2050 lessons, 4800 credits.
Tradeskills & General Misc achievements:
2140 lessons, 885 credits.
Pastebin of the achievements that give lesson/credit/artifact rewards and how I grouped them:
Thanks so much for figuring this out! I note a lot of the bigger rewards seem like they should take a long time (months if not years of play?).
Anyway, now that I'm looking at what Imperian has done, I don't believe we'll go down that route, but we'll look at achievements in the future once we get our feet under us.
Thanks so much for figuring this out! I note a lot of the bigger rewards seem like they should take a long time (months if not years of play?).
Anyway, now that I'm looking at what Imperian has done, I don't believe we'll go down that route, but we'll look at achievements in the future once we get our feet under us.
Yeah, that is true, but there are a bunch of really easy ones that provide a big bang. You get 150 lessons for your first PvP kill (in the PvP area), for example (100 for the kill, 50 for the damage type). Different damage type, another 50. Kick a friend to death, 50 more. 100 lessons for 5 designs. 100 credits for inking tattoos on people.
So there are a bunch of the smaller rewards that you can pick off for a good chunk of initial stuff even past the stuff I pinned as being "super easy". Long-term, though, you're definitely going to have to work to grab a lot of the extra bits.
Edit: I do like achievements, theirs seems kind of like a massive list though. Has to have been built up over a while.
I kinda get where your coming from. With org only designs it's kind of a public item to the extent that anyone in that org can make it and the org points are sort of, to me anyway, about our org vs your org.
So its like ok our peoples made 20 crazy good designs this year that only we can make, ain't we great, suck it other orgs woo points for us
I think this view is valid. I don't think Paris gave a crap how cultured the US thought they were in the 1800's. Seems to me historically, these things were part of ethnocentrism rather than caring what others thought about themselves.
Would it be possible to place some rockeaters in the cave, trout in the lake, and let the pigs turn in at villages from the Newbie area, or in the new intro somewhere? It could be worth increasing the newbie level from 30 to 50 if this was done.
Posting from the other thread, cause it's a good idea. I suggested maybe rock hogs could be rockeater substitutes too? Cause they eat stones, maybe they eat gems to? Maybe? Probably not.
o Aetherflares focusing counter has been lowered to 5 minutes.
o Earning daily credits in an aetherflare will earn your city/commune participation credit.
o Earning daily credits in Wildnodes will earn your city/commune participation credit.
o You can now submit city/commune designs to count towards your org scores. >-----------------------------------------------------------------------------<
I have good news! I can effectively stay out of the resource war because I have a honours quest I like to do! It takes about a hour to do, but it alone generates 18 credits (13 from the quest itself, and 5 from bashing) and well, I can influence guards lazily for the last 2. I think the quests becoming more valuable overall will free up resources and time for everyone else.
Before I go sleep, just wanted to pipe in and acknowledge that I think the system is in a good spot. Not been too frustrating with a balanced approach, and the system's actively encouraging me to explore and check out quests I've previously ignored.
Comments
First having a design approved should give 1 tick of your daily credit rewards if this is possible to do.
Secondly I really think org cartels should count for getting org points on designs.
I really like these two points and I can't see any real downside to it so just wanted to throw them out as ideas if anyone agrees or disagrees.
Hey just posting this list of achievements Imp has. We were speaking about it on discord and you guys asked for a list as an example.
https://ada-young.appspot.com/pastebin/38Wo-04Y
@Xenthos was also curious.
May not have counted everything totally right but I think every achievement in total is about 10,870 lessons and 10,765 credits. (Obs not saying everyones going to get all that of course
Plundering and raiding for example are sort of time locked.
Caravan once every 5ish hours so you can only get a limited number of plunders in. Raids I can't actually remember how often you can do them but it costs generator power to start an official raid. Really not sure how often but I think an org may struggle to do more than a raid every day but I really don't know for certain on that one.
The ones that say kill such and such x times are obviously time restricted in re spawn times with different ones having different times. Could not tell you what the repop times are for each boss guy. Some off the achievement named mobs to kill are soloable some require a group.
Fishing is something I never did so no clue about it.
Some things are admin controlled. Gemhunts would be sort of our version of hamster hunts so you can only get them credits if an admin pop's a hunt.
Leylines switching technically isn't time locked itself but practically it is. It needs shards and you gather shards from a shardfall which is a conflict event roughly every 5ish hours. So you need to harvest shards and use them to flip leylines. Pretty much treat the leylines as a timelocked event for the sake of a compare though. Shard achievements are time locked for the same reason.
Relics are kind of soft time locked because of their drop rate.
Just feel it should give something for sure.
So its like ok our peoples made 20 crazy good designs this year that only we can make, ain't we great, suck it other orgs
Anyway, now that I'm looking at what Imperian has done, I don't believe we'll go down that route, but we'll look at achievements in the future once we get our feet under us.
Entered by: Orael the Anomaly Date: 2019-02-28 02:42:06
o Aetherflares focusing counter has been lowered to 5 minutes.
o Earning daily credits in an aetherflare will earn your city/commune
participation credit.
o Earning daily credits in Wildnodes will earn your city/commune
participation credit.
o You can now submit city/commune designs to count towards your org
scores.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------<
Are only hunting, influencing, domoths, and comm quests based on ticks?
Its always nice to get in group activity and as it needs 5 players, it can not be done just in passing like the other arena games