Indeed, the instance where paradox would ruin your soft lock (or is just outright wasted because it lands on an immunity) would be pretty trash. I don't think that makes the skill trash and I'm not sure how you made that connection but we'll move on.
(I'm the mom of Hallifax btw, so if you are in Hallifax please call me mom.)
== Professional Girl Gamer == Yes I play games Yes I'm a girl get over it
I just think it's a bit ridiculous how this all started because Cyndarin got annoyed that now that there are people to contest her melds that she's not as dominant as she used to be and has to use aeon as a scapegoat. This is like her complaining about the fact that four warriors with a bit of set up was able to damage her out, when she can individually deal about as much damage as the warriors she is complaining about, except she can do it on demand, with absolutely no set up.
People keep saying that this isn't meant to be a nerf to 1v1 for Institute and Moondancers. It has become clear that this is actually not the case. This -will- limit current 1v1 strategies for at least Institute and this equates to a nerf of some degree. For groups, 3 seconds is a very long time and this is nothing but a huge nerf to these (and other) classes. Don't try to disguise it as anything else.
What I find the most ridiculous about all of this is that people like Synkarin have openly stated that there are certain combos that are near unstoppable. He has even used the two bards (or really, one bard and someone else, but it's easier with two bards) deathsong strategy on many occasions. Group v group is a mess and yes, aeon spamming is strong but if I had 4 pyrochems at my disposal I could just instakill people with damage. Heck, let me just unleash staff and have just one other person spamming room damage and we can already wipe everyone but the tankiest people with vitality. There are just so many "overpowered" combinations if you want to talk about group synergies that it's laughable that the one being discussed is the one that is currently beating certain people.
We just can't win. If we lose fights, it's because we're weaker, less experienced, aren't good etc. If we win fights, our skills are just overpowered. You want to complain about people not wanting to fight you? Maybe this is related to that.
I think it's a bit ridiculous that you want to ignore numerous specific arguments being made to make comments about me me wanting meld dominance or some unrelated issue. You do you girls, but please leave out of your petty partisan envoy attacks. I try really hard not to play that game, I will not play it with you now. I will not engage in dishonest personal attacks and misrepresentation just because I don't like an envoy report.
If you want to refute the arguments being made regarding lockout mechanics, the application of immunity mechanics previously for both stun and blackout, you may do so and I will respond appropriately. If you want to make this about me, take it back to your clans and your echo chambers.
If you want to address the report itself, you may do so, rather than demanding to not partake in the envoy process unless you get a special report.
If you want to address damage mechanics, you may do so, as you have a platform to do so.
I don't know what aeon has to do with meld dominance, I have no idea what that correlation is. I don't have meld dominance because I'm not the most active melder and your side has more. I'm sorry, I've been busy with Pride and RL things the past couple weeks as I've notated on forums. That is your mud pit though, and I'm not going to get it in and start slinging it with you.
Not supporting your suggestions to nerf a core mechanic of certain classes without any compensation because it's unfair on them = not wanting to participate in the envoy process.
You are not in any way addressing how a core mechanic getting buffed without any corrective adjustments on the side somehow means that you deserve to get compensated when there is a report to try to bring that core mechanic back down to something more reasonable.
Choosing to not engage in the conversation or the specific points being raised in the report, and instead make malicious comments over forums about the envoy is choosing not the participate in the envoy process. It is attacking the player rather than the information and the report. You are engaging in ad hominems, not the envoy process.
That was your choice. You are entitled to it, but do not come for me because of your decision.
When the overhaul happened. I already made a post about this earlier in the thread, including a bullet list of the things that happened to make aeon stronger. The bullet list did not even include the buff to Aeonfield, to boot!
How exactly does this change Institute 1v1 strategy? I keep hearing how it does, yet anytime I bring it up, nobody actually backs it up with anything. The literally only argument presented against it is 'well paradox may bone you.' How that relates to 1v1, I don't know, Yarith never explained it. I addressed how it can be circumvented in groups rather easily. If you're only using paradox as filler why you build rubies, it'll be over before you really start aeoning, otherwise you need to save your power for timequake.
So no @Falmiis, nobody is trying to draw a veil over anyone's eyes. We've literally said time and time again that yes, this will effect groups strongly, but it will encourage smarter play and not blind spamming. What more do you want? Is it a nerf? Yes it's a nerf, because aeon IS strong no matter how many times you guys try to downplay it. You do realize this changes our strategies as well right? That group fighting on our side will be pretty much equally affected by it? An immunity period applies to everyone, not just enemies of Hallifax.
And back off on the high horse about complaining. All I ever hear is how our skills are so much better, bonds OP, greywhispers OP, pyrochem > aerochem, researchers are weak etc. You guys are a whole lot of debbie downers. I mean, there was literally an issue response that someone felt like they had to abuse a bug because his class was soooo weak. It's always something with you guys.
Stop with the bullshit, if you want to make an argument make it. Nobody has refuted my examples and statements about why this won't affect 1v1 combat.
So I'm late to your list but: A) A little bit of coding will make it so you never run out of steam before aeon. Just tap out your pipe at 3 smokes remaining. Hell, I have two artifact pipes for steam. I can only think of two passive ways to give asthma, those are aerochem fields and druidmelds. Not sure how any other affliction stacking with aeon works to delay the cure? I don't think those are buffs at all. You just have to change the way you handle pipes or get a second. Having a second pipe has always been a thing back when hemiplegy was everywhere, no?
Edit: Once again, other orgs aren't forced into taking aeon. I already explained that paradox lasts long enough to get to timequake. I'm really glad researchers have lots to contribute to combat besides aeon.
(I'm the mom of Hallifax btw, so if you are in Hallifax please call me mom.)
== Professional Girl Gamer == Yes I play games Yes I'm a girl get over it
If your response to every argument is "nobody has refuted my claims" when they have but you just shut them down with what is essentially "you're wrong" then no, nobody can refute your claims.
You guys are right. I'm the only one being partisan here and I just need to stop using overpowered skills and get good like the rest of you have done. Have fun with the rest of this discussion.
If you are getting balance/eq back in 3 seconds from any Aeon ability, that ability needs nerfing.
For all the counter arguments of preparing your pipe ahead of time applies to aeon - prep your target ahead of time so they can't cure aeon in one balance.
It's amazing that people can argue against aeon immunity.
2014/04/19 01:38:01 - Leolamins drained 2000000 power to raise Silvanus as a Vernal Ascendant.
2014/07/23 05:01:29 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Munsia as a Vernal Ascendant.
2015/05/24 06:03:07 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Arimisia as a Vernal Ascendant.
2015/05/24 06:03:58 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Lavinya as a Vernal Ascendant.
I'm sorry, but these sorts of attacks ring a little hollow coming from those who have received mechanical improvements to their skills, such as the Aeonfield penalty or aeon buffs, but made no similar fuss, much less an attempt to address, any changes that benefited them. It seems to me you oppose changes only when those changes aren't in your favor. I address your reports, and when you refute my position and prove me wrong, I change my position and support your report. I don't don't start attacking you in the forums because I was wrong. While some of us are working to restore the status quo and make compromises on our skills (such as burn/wound curing), others like you are engaging in direct personal attacks when envoys try to "nerf", refuse to engage on the points raised, deflect when you are challenged, but remain coincidentally quiet when buffs fall into your lap. Your business Falmiis, but I will not quietly tolerate hypocrisy while you misrepresent both your and my positions on these issues. I am not the one.
No one is arguing against aeon immunity. Aeon immunity without filling the gap is the problem but you're right, there is no gap. Also, I can't prep someone for aeon ahead of time. Malefact is a 2 second balance.
Edit: What is this aeonfield buff everyone keeps talking about?? It still halves your mana and ego upfront.
(I'm the mom of Hallifax btw, so if you are in Hallifax please call me mom.)
== Professional Girl Gamer == Yes I play games Yes I'm a girl get over it
Poison spitting stupidity before you aeon gives you a 33% command rejection. 1/3 of a chance to get to your next balance/eq. (Yes I know shrugging exists but that's slated to be removed according to Ietix).
2014/04/19 01:38:01 - Leolamins drained 2000000 power to raise Silvanus as a Vernal Ascendant.
2014/07/23 05:01:29 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Munsia as a Vernal Ascendant.
2015/05/24 06:03:07 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Arimisia as a Vernal Ascendant.
2015/05/24 06:03:58 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Lavinya as a Vernal Ascendant.
If your response to every argument is "nobody has refuted my claims" when they have but you just shut them down with what is essentially "you're wrong" then no, nobody can refute your claims.
You guys are right. I'm the only one being partisan here and I just need to stop using overpowered skills and get good like the rest of you have done. Have fun with the rest of this discussion.
I went back and re-read the report, as well as this thread. Any instance trying to justify why researchers would be hurting 1v1 due to this has been shown that it's not actually a concern (you know, that's how discussion works, you bring up points and then the other person brings up his points etc).
I've shown why @Yarith paradox wouldn't be issue and how to get around it in groups,
but yet you've ignored my posts while trying to claim I've ignore theirs.
Feel free to quote something I missed, it's certainly possible, but when your response is 'well people do, but you just say they are wrong.' then maybe it's actually you that is wrong and not me. That's how discussions work.
I just think it's a bit ridiculous how this all started because Cyndarin got annoyed that now that there are people to contest her melds that she's not as dominant as she used to be and has to use aeon as a scapegoat. This is like her complaining about the fact that four warriors with a bit of set up was able to damage her out, when she can individually deal about as much damage as the warriors she is complaining about, except she can do it on demand, with absolutely no set up.
People keep saying that this isn't meant to be a nerf to 1v1 for Institute and Moondancers. It has become clear that this is actually not the case. This -will- limit current 1v1 strategies for at least Institute and this equates to a nerf of some degree. For groups, 3 seconds is a very long time and this is nothing but a huge nerf to these (and other) classes. Don't try to disguise it as anything else.
What I find the most ridiculous about all of this is that people like Synkarin have openly stated that there are certain combos that are near unstoppable. He has even used the two bards (or really, one bard and someone else, but it's easier with two bards) deathsong strategy on many occasions. Group v group is a mess and yes, aeon spamming is strong but if I had 4 pyrochems at my disposal I could just instakill people with damage. Heck, let me just unleash staff and have just one other person spamming room damage and we can already wipe everyone but the tankiest people with vitality. There are just so many "overpowered" combinations if you want to talk about group synergies that it's laughable that the one being discussed is the one that is currently beating certain people.
We just can't win. If we lose fights, it's because we're weaker, less experienced, aren't good etc. If we win fights, our skills are just overpowered. You want to complain about people not wanting to fight you? Maybe this is related to that.
I just want to reiterate that I've been critical of aeon for years now. Aeon and sap. Actually, aeon longer than sap (though sap is definitely worse than aeon).
Comparing aeon to all the other "many 'overpowered' combinations" (in your words) is missing my point, deliberately or mistakenly. If you read my post, the main, and pretty much only thing I compared aeon to is stun. Its shutdown potential, its very mechanics are a problem - are the problem. It is an immensely unfun mechanic to play with, and against. The only thing more unfun is sap (see my comment above). My stance from the very beginning, since I was arguing with the Saesh, the admin back before we settled on this version 3 of the Overhaul, was to delete aeon.
Aeon as a mechanic (in my opinion) adds little to nothing to this game. The only thing that is blocking its removal for the health of the combat meta is the argument, from Estarra herself, that it serves as one of the few remaining differentiators of top-tier combatants to everyone else. I contest that, but I have yet to craft a fully convincing argument against it. I have not stopped, and will not stop, expressing where I think aeon fails to bring dimension and scope to the game.
Other than aeon and aeon-like effects, only stun, sleep and unconsciousness give comparable command denial: ie fully denied. My opposition to sleeplocks is also something that I believe is obvious enough. Hunger was also something I have expressed dislike against, though not on the forums. But up until hunger tactics was removed, I have also repeatedly expressed support for envoy reports to nerf and remove hunger as a mechanic. Stun is an affliction that I have always been wary of, and have always pointed out is extremely powerful to the point of requiring a lot of limitations, and I have also urged caution against putting more stun into the game.
The only thing that has been inconsistent in my arguments was when I argued against removing and changing choke as a newbie.
Stun is, compared to aeon, much more powerful in many respects. It blocks all commands not indirectly, but directly. It is a mechanical inability to do anything to interact with the game. It cannot, however, be stacked on itself or extended in any way. This give-and-take, and the absolute lack of stun when compared to the prevalence of aeon, makes it far more balanced as a finisher, or as a disrupter affliction. The very small windows with which it can be used effectively, and the way it punishes the thoughtless user by reseting their offense is exactly what is described in the last page or so of this thread, and really is a perfectly acceptable drawback to such a powerful disable.
Aeon, in comparison, is an indirect command denial by the way it disrupts curing priority. If you want to choose to emote while aeoned, you can. But you won't, because it's more efficient to cure out of aeon, and then cure everything else that can be cured simultaneously AND emote at the same time. I have repeatedly said that aeon is "effectively" a stun, simply because the only logical response to aeon is to do nothing (other than curing aeon) until it is cured. Why would it be acceptable for such a stun-like affliction to be made a core part of a kit, much less an entire org, was beyond me, and still is beyond me. How people can argue that such a kit should remain unrestricted and continue to revolve around aeon stacking and keeping targets in aeon as a kill strategy is beyond me. Why people would be willing to continue to argue for the existence of a combat interaction where the target is denied of their (active) class abilities is beyond me.
I'll put it this way. As a monk, I can forget all my guild skills, and there will be zero change in what I can bring to a fight when fighting against sap and aeon as in a fight when I am not. The affliction that makes such a scenario possible is unacceptable to me.
Aeonlocks and saplocks (and sleeplocks) are pretty much stunlocks. They are different because their length and effectiveness can be mitigated by proper curing (see comment about Estarra's argument). But it is patently, objectively and provably un-fun as a mechanic. For the scant bit of strategy (curing knowledge and coding ability) it brings to combat, it also comes with the luggage of frustration that literally cannot be topped by anything else in the combat meta. Well, perhaps the best rivals to destructive and unfun mechanics would be invulnerability abilities like suspendedanimation. (Which incidentally, is approved for an envoy change)
There was a reason why pronelocks were removed where found.
Comparing between IREs is always fraught with dangers due to the huge contextual differences between the games. I am, myself, not familiar with all of the combat scene in the other IREs. But there's at least a precedent that is arguably relatable in Aetolia. I'll just say this: there was a reason the aeon there was changed to be the way it is now - and it is a reason that is very similar to the frustration the players forced to deal with sap and aeon are facing.
Unlike Sidd and Celina, my agenda is to push for the total deletion of aeon and sap and similar abilities. Not for simply limiting its prevalence. It is an effect that really has no place in the modern Lusternian combat meta.
Using Aetolia as a precedent for anything combat related is absolutely silly, the entire combat mechanic there is automation initiated with a button push and a kill command, because there is no dynamic save for who is a better coder than the other person, or who has the most balance/Equilibrium recovery or artifacts to overpower their opponent.
Coming from there, I can say wholeheartedly that using them as a comparison is bad. Truly I dont see aeon/sap as a horrible mechanic, I think they certainly have their place in the meta just perhaps not in the current incarnation(?).
-If this argument was something Retardation related (which I have been informed was akin to the old choke mechanics) I would be speaking up better.
I'm no top notch combatant, but I have been in combat here, its not about nerfing skills or deletion especially when you have a class that is so centrally focused around Aeon (cough Institute) its about the way it works with skills that is the issue which I see argued more and more, I mean my understanding is part of being an Envoy is looking at things from an objective and unbiased standpoint, and whilst we have our personal feelings obviously on skills, one also must consider what the ramifications of removal of skills changes in the meta. For those who want removal, they need to also be coming up with a means of improving as well, I see alot of remove but not enough constructive, but instead of X how about Y.
Ultimately the single objective focus of Keep or Delete, is going to put a sour taste in anyones mouth on either side of this continuous discussion in regards to skills.
Lets not devolve potential for the allure of frustrations.
EDIT: Holy shit, I'm sorry if the formatting is terrible. Phone forums are a mess.
I've got numbers! I'll post them once I get home to my laptop this weekend. Basically, for the moment, a Researcher needs a certain amount of Timewarp (massive) in order to reach the Timequake kill condition. The most efficiet way to do this is to
1. Build rubies (7 rubies, or 5 rubies if the Researcher is willing to burn 5p to set up Resonance first).
2. Stick Oracle/TimeEchoes (3p each, has a chance to afflict with a random amalgamation of affs + chance for Timewarp).
3. Shatterplex (0p, IIRC 3.5s? This uses up all rubies in order to bump someone to Massive Timewarp).
4. Finally, Timequake (8p single target. There is a 10p version that takes out all Massively Timewarped enemies in the room).
The issue is in the fact that between step 3 and 4, the target is always going to cure off a couple of Timewarp levels due to balance/equilibrium times. So, the Researcher has to find a way to slow down the target's curing in order to land the Timequake. That's when Aeon comes in with all its fanfare.
Researchers have 3 ways to dish out Aeon (+1 for Tarot, +1 for Astrology*). That's
1. Active Aeon (3.2s bal/eq, plus minus 0.1-0.2s because latency).
2. Aeonfield (5p, mana/ego malus, ticks aeon every 10s to all present enemies).
3. Paradox (chance of aeon + other effects).
Now, let's try using just active Aeon. In order to stick it, of course, the Researcher would usually have to do it twice on account of Quicksilver. Even after Aeon actually sticks, it'll be cured off before the Researcher regains balance in order to Shatterplex -> Timequake.
One way that Aeon could be made to stick is to use Asthma, which Researchers have access to via MalefactGem. Iirc it is also somewhere in the region of 2s. Aeon slows down commands to a 1s delay. In a group, yes, this usually means fighting Researchers means fighting in perpetual aeon, but 1v1, the bal/eq costs prohibit their use.
So, the problem remains: bal/eq costs make the use of just active Aeon unhelpful in a 1v1 scenario. That's when we bring out Aeonfield. It ticks aeon every 10s. A Researcher could viably time an active Aeon right before an Aeonfield tick in order to make the affliction stick. However, the Researcher still needs to use 2 balances (shatterplex->timequake), and as already mentioned, MalefactGem Asthma isn't a viable option due to its bal/eq cost.
That's when a sweet usage of Quicken (3p, 25/25 equilibrium boost) comes in. Active Aeon uses EQ, while Shatterplex runs on BAL, along with MalefactGem. The idea is that, after building up enough rubies, a Researcher could do Quicken -> Shatterplex -> Aeon spam and hope Oracles/TimeEchoes give back the Timewarp levels that would inevitably be lost after the Shatterplex in order to bring it home with a Timequake (the power should have regened back to 8p, but I'll be honest, I'm not 100% sure on this).
This is, for the moment, the most and maybe only viable way to land a TimeQuake 1v1. It may be improved upon by using a beast to deal afflictions that will further aid in slowing down Timewarp curing long enough to finish it. But this does require the target to be under constant Aeon for the latter portion, and the proposed 3s Aeon immunity would remove this.
You should speak to people like Shedrin. You can certainly use malefectgem to stick aeon long enough to pull off shatterplex/timequake.
As it is. The immunity would not affect that at all. If I cured out of aeon before you timequaked, I'd have cured enough timewarp (all it needs is one smoke). I'll also note that timewarp being on steam now gives you more leeway(about 1 extra second) to stick timequake than before when timewarp was on horehound/focus because it's stacking the same balance. Again, if I'm curing out of aeon and you are just sticking aeon again without setting it up, I'll cure out before you get balance back even if you do it immediately (1 sec to regain balance, 1 sec to cure, you still have 1.2 sec of eq left), meaning immunity or not, I'm still fine and you're still wasting your balance.
That won't be the case once the serverside curing queue goes in. Malefact is 2 seconds offbal, shatterplex is 3. Even with amnesia on beast they have a 3 second window to smoke steam and just leave the room/shield/gust, and that's after they've cured asthma.
Timewarps requires aeon to build as it's the only affliction in the spiritual pool which a researcher can inflict. No spiritual affs = no timewarp buildup.
Edit: Which means to build timewarps you have to be -freqently- applying aeon.
(I'm the mom of Hallifax btw, so if you are in Hallifax please call me mom.)
== Professional Girl Gamer == Yes I play games Yes I'm a girl get over it
The 'setup' is with the Oracle/TimeEchoes effects. They have a chance to deal out the Timewarp necessary (after Shatterplexing) to Timequake.
By the way, Oracle and TimeEchoes fire ~14s, slightly randomized, each giving 1 timewarp count. Smoke steam cures ~2 timewarp counts, again with a slight random chance for more or less (I'll say it again: I hate the tiny randomization of these things, like the RNG of Illuminati).
Honestly, the main issue with Researcher offense is that I think there are just 2 spiritual affs we use: timewarp and aeon. Wtb more spiritual affs.
The answer is simple. Delete aeon, and give researchers other spiritual afflictions.
Even removing the bard aurics, you have the choice of disloyalty, healthleech, pacifism, slickness and luminosity, some of which are potent as afflictions in and of themselves.
Aeon as a crutch for timewarp building is actually a misnomer. Aeon can be used to build everything. Give me aeon, and I will give you an argument about how aeon is central to my kit of building bleeding. I've mentioned this in a previous post, but aeon synergizes with everything.
If aeon is your crutch to build timewarp, the same way sap has served as the druids' crutch, you will find that timewarp will never get the mechanics it needs to be competitive and fun. Because aeon is in the way. As it is, I find timewarp and tempinsanity tiresome mechanics, anyway.
---
On the topic of Aetolia, I have already acknowledged the dangers of comparing between IREs. I'm not going to turn this to talk about Aetolia combat, but as much as it was a bad idea to bring it up to support my argument, I also feel sweeping their entire combat system into a claim that it has "no dynamic save for who is a better coder than the other person... etc" is one that is at least as questionable. Especially given how the backbone of IRE combat DOES share several points (which is at best a tenuous connection, but one nonetheless)
Regardless, even if we render my ill-advised comparison as completely invalid, my points about aeon as a ridiculously frustrating mechanic remains. I have zero motivation to spend my combat doing nothing but curing out of aeon (or sap), and whether it is fun for the user to invest every bit of their time to upkeeping an aeonlock (or saplock, or sleeplock) is also questionable at best. At the very least, it is a mechanical interaction that robs one party of their entire offense, and on that point alone, it is a problematic affliction. As I mentioned before, pronelocks were removed for a very good reason.
Suggesting replacements for aeon is all well and good. And I'm perfectly willing to take part in that discussion, if the envoy and players who use aeon the most are willing to allow me to participate. However, the discussion needs to move beyond accusations of partisanship and of denying the need of change to aeon - which is exactly what has happened over the last two pages. We aren't at the stage of suggesting replacements because those invested in aeon are arguing against the change in the first place.
I'm in this for the long haul. Before we talk about replacements, we need to present a united front and a proper argument to Estarra that outlines the reasons for aeon's removal in a way that convinces her to make the progressive step forward. That's not going to happen for as long as people are arguing against it - in the meantime, incremental changes are all that we can do. For my part, I will continue to express my opinions as consistently as I can, and as many times as need be.
I, personally, don't mind changing mechanics as long as everyone first understands how exactly they work. Too often have people argued over an ability with neither side understanding it completely (ie Paradigmatics Badluck's second incarnation). As long as everyone is on the same page regarding how something currently works, then we can talk about tweaks.
I have 48 god damn notifications. You guys suck. =((
Time to go turn off notifications.
Avurekhos says, "Dylara's a PvP menace in my eyes, totes rekting face."
The eye of Dylara materialises in your hands and flings itself around your neck, tightening incomprehensibly until it is irremovable. Perfectly clean, this eyeball has been wrenched from the socket of Dylara. It has been animated by some unusual force, constantly looking around itself as if in shock or fear. It is bathed in a light covering of white flames that roll endlessly over its surface. A single chain of empyreal metal pierces either side of the eye, allowing it to be worn around the neck.
Yeah the better way to timequake is to beast amnesia and shatter on aeonfields passive aeon. It's relatively easy to disrupt, but if they don't, they're dead. The kill window stays open really long, which makes us pretty scary IMO.
Note nerfing AF will probably make timequake 1v1 near impossible without refresh power strategies. I do think AF is one of the most insane skills in the game, but 1v1 we need it.
I think the point that's getting skipped over here that's relevant is what Falmiis said: once we count groups, there are so many kill strategies that are basically unstoppable. What I see are a bunch of gaudis trying to nerf hallis #1 tool.
Similarly, in groups I see people spamming damage over and over again. Death is like complete command denial. There should be damage immunity for 1s after every attack because sometimes I die.
Damage doesn't completely lock you out of doing anything about the fact that you're being damaged.
Aeon screws you over if you're locked and you literally have to just take your hands off the keyboard and wait for the system to do what it's supposed to do and hope you either get rescued or that whomever coded your system did it right and you've somehow, miraculously, set the right curing priorities. I suppose you can try to do it manually but that's going to require code which tracks what afflictions you have to cure in order to get out of aeon. I'm sorry, I want to combat without needing 15 codes that I don't understand and can't customize.
I really thought that the point of the overhaul was to make combat more accessible for newcomers. Aeon/Sap/Sleeplock/etc. are all mechanics that turn new people off to getting involved. When you can't actively get yourself out of it without a coded system to maximize efficiency AND can't do anything actively to try to slow down the offensive of the other person (so it doesn't just get worse) It's beyond frustrating.
Comments
== Professional Girl Gamer ==
Yes I play games
Yes I'm a girl
get over it
We just can't win. If we lose fights, it's because we're weaker, less experienced, aren't good etc. If we win fights, our skills are just overpowered. You want to complain about people not wanting to fight you? Maybe this is related to that.
That's not how balance works.
== Professional Girl Gamer ==
Yes I play games
Yes I'm a girl
get over it
A) A little bit of coding will make it so you never run out of steam before aeon. Just tap out your pipe at 3 smokes remaining. Hell, I have two artifact pipes for steam.
== Professional Girl Gamer ==
Yes I play games
Yes I'm a girl
get over it
Also, I can't prep someone for aeon ahead of time. Malefact is a 2 second balance.
== Professional Girl Gamer ==
Yes I play games
Yes I'm a girl
get over it
Except they haven't @Falmiis
I've got numbers! I'll post them once I get home to my laptop this weekend. Basically, for the moment, a Researcher needs a certain amount of Timewarp (massive) in order to reach the Timequake kill condition. The most efficiet way to do this is to
1. Build rubies (7 rubies, or 5 rubies if the Researcher is willing to burn 5p to set up Resonance first).
2. Stick Oracle/TimeEchoes (3p each, has a chance to afflict with a random amalgamation of affs + chance for Timewarp).
3. Shatterplex (0p, IIRC 3.5s? This uses up all rubies in order to bump someone to Massive Timewarp).
4. Finally, Timequake (8p single target. There is a 10p version that takes out all Massively Timewarped enemies in the room).
The issue is in the fact that between step 3 and 4, the target is always going to cure off a couple of Timewarp levels due to balance/equilibrium times. So, the Researcher has to find a way to slow down the target's curing in order to land the Timequake. That's when Aeon comes in with all its fanfare.
Researchers have 3 ways to dish out Aeon (+1 for Tarot, +1 for Astrology*). That's
1. Active Aeon (3.2s bal/eq, plus minus 0.1-0.2s because latency).
2. Aeonfield (5p, mana/ego malus, ticks aeon every 10s to all present enemies).
3. Paradox (chance of aeon + other effects).
Now, let's try using just active Aeon. In order to stick it, of course, the Researcher would usually have to do it twice on account of Quicksilver. Even after Aeon actually sticks, it'll be cured off before the Researcher regains balance in order to Shatterplex -> Timequake.
One way that Aeon could be made to stick is to use Asthma, which Researchers have access to via MalefactGem. Iirc it is also somewhere in the region of 2s. Aeon slows down commands to a 1s delay. In a group, yes, this usually means fighting Researchers means fighting in perpetual aeon, but 1v1, the bal/eq costs prohibit their use.
So, the problem remains: bal/eq costs make the use of just active Aeon unhelpful in a 1v1 scenario. That's when we bring out Aeonfield. It ticks aeon every 10s. A Researcher could viably time an active Aeon right before an Aeonfield tick in order to make the affliction stick. However, the Researcher still needs to use 2 balances (shatterplex->timequake), and as already mentioned, MalefactGem Asthma isn't a viable option due to its bal/eq cost.
That's when a sweet usage of Quicken (3p, 25/25 equilibrium boost) comes in. Active Aeon uses EQ, while Shatterplex runs on BAL, along with MalefactGem. The idea is that, after building up enough rubies, a Researcher could do Quicken -> Shatterplex -> Aeon spam and hope Oracles/TimeEchoes give back the Timewarp levels that would inevitably be lost after the Shatterplex in order to bring it home with a Timequake (the power should have regened back to 8p, but I'll be honest, I'm not 100% sure on this).
This is, for the moment, the most and maybe only viable way to land a TimeQuake 1v1. It may be improved upon by using a beast to deal afflictions that will further aid in slowing down Timewarp curing long enough to finish it. But this does require the target to be under constant Aeon for the latter portion, and the proposed 3s Aeon immunity would remove this.
== Professional Girl Gamer ==
Yes I play games
Yes I'm a girl
get over it
By the way, Oracle and TimeEchoes fire ~14s, slightly randomized, each giving 1 timewarp count. Smoke steam cures ~2 timewarp counts, again with a slight random chance for more or less (I'll say it again: I hate the tiny randomization of these things, like the RNG of Illuminati).
Honestly, the main issue with Researcher offense is that I think there are just 2 spiritual affs we use: timewarp and aeon. Wtb more spiritual affs.
The eye of Dylara materialises in your hands and flings itself around your neck, tightening incomprehensibly until it is irremovable.
Perfectly clean, this eyeball has been wrenched from the socket of Dylara. It has been animated by some unusual force, constantly looking around itself as if in shock or fear. It is bathed in a light covering of white flames that roll endlessly over its surface. A single chain of empyreal metal pierces either side of the eye, allowing it to be worn around the neck.
Ixion tells you, "// I don't think anyone else had a clue, amazing form."
(edit: horrible phone formatting)
Aeon screws you over if you're locked and you literally have to just take your hands off the keyboard and wait for the system to do what it's supposed to do and hope you either get rescued or that whomever coded your system did it right and you've somehow, miraculously, set the right curing priorities. I suppose you can try to do it manually but that's going to require code which tracks what afflictions you have to cure in order to get out of aeon. I'm sorry, I want to combat without needing 15 codes that I don't understand and can't customize.
I really thought that the point of the overhaul was to make combat more accessible for newcomers. Aeon/Sap/Sleeplock/etc. are all mechanics that turn new people off to getting involved. When you can't actively get yourself out of it without a coded system to maximize efficiency AND can't do anything actively to try to slow down the offensive of the other person (so it doesn't just get worse) It's beyond frustrating.