Question of the Day!

Estarra

If there was one thing you would do to make Lusternia or your class simpler to play (combat-wise), what would it be?

Synkarin

if I could do 7k damage an attack

Rivius

Good question. I don't think there's anything I'd like to make simpler as far as my class goes. I think it hits the goldie-locks amount of simplicity and complexity that makes it very fun to play. Not a lot of programming is needed offensively and most of the difficulty just arises from the number of nuances it brings (which is also what makes it so fun).

There are a lot of factors and mechanics to be aware of, but as far as execution goes, it isn't complicated at all. I only wish:-

- Certain things were more standardized, for example the effects of dex, but that's a topic in itself.

- There were less specific abilities that inequitably affect us.

Karlach

I'd remove the RNG from warrior combat, and put the damage and hindering afflictions more in the hands of players.

Random miss would go out the window for a start.

Ssaliss

I guess "Simplify afflictions" is technically one thing, but... yeah, a pretty massive thing. That's basically what has stopped me from any serious combat when I tried it as an alt.

Shuyin

1. Make effects more quantifiable and reliable, less RNG.

2. Expand all the AB files to actually explain what the skill does, instead of just being vague. If a skill has a 20% chance to resist x, y, and z afflictions, say so instead of 'This skill has a chance to resist some afflictions'.

3. Flesh out the WHATISCUREDBY, WHATCURES, etc database to explain what an affliction does and what skill/classes can give it.

4. Delete multiple cures. 1 kind of cure for 1 aff (within reason).

5. Delete unnecessary balances *coughpurgativecough*

But really, if you wanted 1 thing:

Be more transparent about skills and formulas if you're not willing to make things less random.

Thul

Alter the cures for some of the afflictions to reduce the amount of different curatives you need to carry on you at all times. 17 different kinds of herbs, 15 different kinds of potions, plus enchantments currently.

Also, personally, I'd like for crotamine to stack with something besides powersap.

Ciaran

I'd make all psionics balances be equal (4.5s?).  This would need some rebalancing, but it would simplify TK/TP combat significantly.

Enyalida

(For druids)

If I got one conceptual change and that's it, I'd shoot big:

I'd remove demesne mechanics.

Shuyin

Oh if we're gonna talk about changes related to a class, this is what I'd want to happen in Lusternia:

Make every class have an instakill that is reliable and independent of tertiary choice. Adjust their offense to build towards this condition.

That's my vision of Lusternia as far as PvP goes. Balancing would be so much easier if every class had a definite and effective end goal so that we can balance the myriad of skills around this. If your goal is to win the big game, you need to figure out what exactly that entails.

Moi

What Shuyin said, 10000 times over.

Shedrin

I'd go even one step further.

Give each class two viable kill methods that are (decently) tert independant.

It's great to have one method, but that also makes you predictable and boring. Two methods make a class much more interesting and balanced, imo.

Now, there's a lot of changes I would make to Institute given a chance, but I would start here:

Remove all AoE from Researchers. All Harmonics and Aeonics skills would now only hit one person that you target. This includes the following skills: Balestone, Mendingstone, Glorygem, Timequake, Aeonfield. Paradox is pseudo-AoE in that it can hit multiple people, but only one per tic. It can probably stay unchanged, as it's 10p and a Trans ability.

I think this is a good change both balance-wise, and simplicity-wise. The way this makes things simpler is less reliance on managing ally and enemy lists, less spam, and less necessity to focus on multiple people at once.

Sahmiam

A governing principle or principles that dictate the approach to skill design and balancing that is consistently applied.

Each archetype would have its own subset.

Some examples of what I'm talking about:

- "Make every class have an instakill that is reliable and independent of tertiary choice. Adjust their offense to build towards this condition." -- Shuyin

- Afflictions must be unique, have meaningful effects, and have definitive cures.

- All skills should have a meaningful place or use within the game and each guild.

- Every class should have options to encourage diversity and experimentation.

- Skill effects must be documented such that intent as well as implementation is clear, including formulas. (No more "Is this a bug or feature?" questions.)

Class specific principles for monks:

- Every guild should have a viable way to form a hardlock

- Any regen affliction should have a momentum penalty*

- Balancing should be attempted through adjusting ka weights whenever possible**

- Powerful forms should not sustain or increase momentum and should require levels four or five.

* A momentum penalty is defined as either -1 momentum or a delayed effect with -0 momentum (grapple ender that require a grapple to initiate). Higher penalties are acceptable for strong afflictions.

I really think this approach is needed because without it, anything has a chance to be reactionary or hackneyed, and only compound the problems rather than helping. I also believe that having principles to follow equates to less work overall and provides consistent criteria to balance around.

Svorai

Going to agree with Shuyin on one important point: 

Providing LOTS of in game information about one's skills in AB files, general HELP files and FIRSTAID. 

Without testing or asking, runists sometimes can't tell what their skills do. This is all the information we have for Sigil, for example:

AB RUNES

Sigil               This rune warns of a draining of the aura.

AB RUNES SIGIL

RUNES - SIGIL

purple 1

Alban

I want to reiterate Shuyin's request to make the AB files more specific. It would even be nice if the AB file offered links to the "whatcures" file because it's not even always obvious what the name of the affliction is that your ability gives.

To explain why this would make things so much easier: when I sat down to go through all my Aeromancer abilities and workout a strategy, I just couldn't do it. Right now, it's extremely difficult to figure out how your class is supposed to work because the AB files give vague descriptions of what skills do, instead of spelling it out. 

Things I need to know: 

How fast is this skill? 

Does it take and/or require eq/bal? 

Can I do this while off psi balance?

What affliction does it give? 

What all cures that affliction?

What is every effect of that affliction? If it stuns, how long does it stun for?

Now some of that stuff can be divided out into separate help files (and some already is,) but I should be able to obtain all of it, and I really need to if I want to be competent at playing my class. The burden of knowledge is enormous, especially for new players.

For example, look at he AB file for addiction, one of the most important abilities a Telepath has:

Syntax:   PSI <channel> ADDICTION <target>

Channels: Substratus, Id

Telepathically rewire the mind of your target, which will inflict

obsessive behavior that leaves them addicted to potions.

This doesn't really tell you anything. I would add a new set of help files, in addition to "whatcures", call it "effectsof" or something. Then every AB file for every ability should list additional helpfiles to check out.

Substratus:   Lower thought waves (fastest channel).

Superstratus: Higher thought waves (slower channel).

Id:           Primitive thought waves (varies based on ego).

Here's another example. I really need to know exactly how fast "fastest" and how slow "slowest" is.

Xenthos

For my class in specific:
I would add in a skill to Crow (and possibly Stag) which provides a small bonus to critical hit chances, but only when the skillset is active (not skillflexed).

This would provide the two with a PvE bonus to help make them more competitive with their counterparts, without skewing the balance of Druids in PvP.  We'd be moving one skillset to be somewhat better at the PvE end and the other more for dealing with PvP, giving more choice (instead of just always having to go, "Well, Night's the best all around, but Crow's tricksy!  Yay Crow!")

Xenthos

I guess re-writing the Maneuvers scroll to be more detailed / less confusing would go a long way too.  The Ebonguard had to actually write our own maneuver help file to clear up the confusion, because the one in-game leads people to believe that it will increase their chances of getting higher-level-affs (which it doesn't do).

A specific example of clearer and better information!

Eventru

Xenthos said:

I guess re-writing the Maneuvers scroll to be more detailed / less confusing would go a long way too.  The Ebonguard had to actually write our own maneuver help file to clear up the confusion, because the one in-game leads people to believe that it will increase their chances of getting higher-level-affs (which it doesn't do).

A specific example of clearer and better information!

Suggestion on a rewrite?

Xenthos

I do not really have access to it right now, but maybe Morkarion can c/p the EG scroll for you. I've lost count of the number of times I have been told how much it was appreciated.

I'm sure it has issues of its own as well, but I imagine that a merging of its details along with the current scroll would get you to a decent place.

Ushaara

If this is with an eye to making it easier for new players, along with the greater clarity suggestions, I'd suggest a full roll out of the current arena only auto-curing. Not being able to stay alive long enough to fight back, escape, or even recognise what's happening to them I think is the biggest deterrent to getting new people into combat.

As a warrior specific suggestion, again geared at new players, maybe an auto-raze option?

Dys

I get overwhelmed by the amount of text and by people moving about, even one on one.

There's a lot of text that most people don't need to see all the time, like everyone sipping, scrolling, eating. It would be nice if that was configurable, maybe as part of obliviousness, or tagged somehow to make it easier to gag. Things like (Vadi's?) demesne compressor are great for cutting it down.

I often miss whether my own actions are failing or succeeding and flail away against someone that's not there or where I've mistyped. Maybe these could be configurably coloured or optionally tagged too, like orange for fail, green for success.

Tracking down people that run is hard without scent/dingbat map + autowalk. Especially with shroud masking that they've left in the first place. Not sure what could be done. Perhaps something like incurable athsma that lasts for ten seconds when you've been attacked? That wouldn't be nice with run or die afflictions though.

These can all be solved client side but it's a lot of effort so some way of making it configurable server side or easier with tags would help me.

Kalnid

ab axelord maneuvers says

First, you will only inflict wounds from that list. So if you want to always inflict a lower level wound even if the target body part is in critical
condition then a maneuver consisting only of that lower level wound will do just that.

which I think is pretty much accurate but could maybe use clarification. It also says

Secondly, provided your wound list is small, you will be able to concentrate more than normal on perfectly executing the attack. This increases your chance of executing that wound. Thus if you use a maneuver that consists only of a critical level wound, you lose the ability to do the lower level wounds, but in exchange you increase the likelihood of successfully making that critical wound happen.

which as far as I'm aware is generally considered to be totes false. The SG's got three different scrolls on maneuvers, and they all focus on the first part. It's also not mentioned explicitly in the ab that it's only the action that the maneuver contains, so you can stick, say, head and leg wounds in a single strike maneuver and have it do whatever depending on which you aim at later, which is useful to know as long as point two is false. Not so necessary, but something to keep in mind. Keep in mind I'm a pretty terrible warrior, so some of my interpretations might be off.

Three scrolls for a core class mechanic is a lot no matter what, though.

Rivius

We're working on condensing those scrolls. It can certainly be done in one.

Kio

@Dys: These things are largely solved solely by experience and good echoes. Keeping someone pinned down or chasing effectively is a very important part of solo combat, and one that everyone struggles with. Running is also the most effective way to stay alive.

As for simplifying combat for warriors, I don't think there's that much that needs done. I'd probably reiterate what's already been said, in that our afflictions need to be a little more reliable. I'm fine with RNG, but there comes a time when skill is outplayed by bad luck (and I'm not talking Paradigmatics).

Also, I know this has been railed into the ground, but some sort of stat pack system. Right now, some races that have very rich RP see no play because combat is so tricky that they just can't do it. I'd like to see a move away from base RP choices being stifled by the inability to perform.

Alban

My one suggestion for mage/druid combat specifically: 

Automatically make all demesne effects hit at the same time, regardless of when they were cast. 

I would say let the meld have a 10 second timer. Every 10 seconds the demesne fires off every effect cast in it.

Akyaevin

It's beneficial for the Geomancers at least to have some effects offset (having stonerain hit one second before the rest of the hit, having tremors hit midway between main hits). This could be adjusted in other ways, though (having stonerain and equivalents always hit first, changing tremors), and would certainly simplify a lot of things.

Alban

It would be more work, but you could even add an ability to all the druidry/mancer specs to let you configure the order they hit.

Kiradawea

If I get a say... phase out illusions from combat.

Silvanus

Not letting my Demon die and ruining my entire offense (and defense).

Karlach

Xenthos said:

I do not really have access to it right now, but maybe Morkarion can c/p the EG scroll for you. I've lost count of the number of times I have been told how much it was appreciated. I'm sure it has issues of its own as well, but I imagine that a merging of its details along with the current scroll would get you to a decent place.

http://pastebin.com/pGQnwYaM

Synkarin

Druids can benefit from offset affects as well