Disclaimer, I re-watched Avatar: the Legend of Korra.
Parhelion is our TA now. The Seals were repaired. But, the "new" Seal of Time, still slightly out of synch with the others, hiccups, and an alternate timeline crashes into ours: a timeline wherein Ixion won and took TA. Their Ixion absorbs our Ixion, so now we just have TA Ixion (who is still Ixion the player).
The Seal of Time, damaged from the hiccup, needs repairing. But it's too soon for another full Trial of Ascension. Avechna decides that this must be sudden death. Parhelion and two companions must face off against Ixion (/whatever his TA name will be) and his two companions. The two teams will be on Astral by themselves, where they must fight once more for the Staff. Since this is a quick-and-dirty Trial, they only need to race to 1800 (only Ixion and Parhelion can get points, but their companions can run for the Staff).
Someone wins. Avechna blesses that TA again. As a consequence of two consecutive Trials in such a short span of time, the rest of the Seals get extra-strong and are now immune from being broken. Kethuru is now permanently trapped beyond Astral, yahoo! The line of True Ascendants is broken, and a new line begins: the Ascendants of Time, with the first one being whoever wins the quickie Final Trial. The Big Bads will now be threats from other timelines (keeping with the overall theme that Lusternia has been going since last year, with timequakes and anomalies and such).
I would be open to posthumously awarding Ciaran true ascendant. This would not have any effect mechanically (as the character is retired), but I think it would make Equinox feel better. I do feel that raising a second ascendant and doing nothing for the other side is wrong and will (and has) result in some hurt feelings. I think this also may give Ciaran's player some resolution.
If the admin's position is that it will be better for the game in the long run, and less people will quit/retire/be bitter, I get it. But please don't try to act as if it's fair. What would have been fair would have been to cancel the event, but since it couldn't be done after the fact, the next best thing was to try to compensate both sides of the competition. The problem is you forgot to compensate my former alliance. Orael's position, as I understand it, is that ascending Choros is the compensation, but he doesn't seem to realize that Choros' ascension is only a compensation if he is nullifying the fact that Choros won the ascension event.
So by my understanding, winning the event was made impossible by active admin intervention, something completely out of the hands of anyone within our alliance. Can you see why this is not well received? ...
There is absolutely no question that there is no malign intent or bias from Aonia, Oreal, or any of the other Godmin. I just think they've made a series of mistakes here that we as the aggrieved parties are failing to properly convey.
And I am not sure how to convey it. But I think your post is important, especially the bits I clipped out here.
I have maybe a little bit unique of a perspective to offer in terms of IHC IC/OOC.
Seren leadership has had a lot on their OOC plates. When it came time to support someone for TA, Gaudiguch wanted to support Dys and Magnagora wanted to support Ixion, and Serenwilde was the tie-breaking vote. We voted together as a commune when we had a high enough population to have a semi-fair representation of what characters wanted, and while Ixion overwhelmingly won the vote, my character Lief was one of two to voice support for someone who wouldn't be undead. She noted that while she would fight for Creation and honor the alliance's wishes, since Serenwilde had the opportunity, she thought it would be best to support someone she could feel good about supporting.
IC, I'm not fully sure how she will react to someone undead gaining TA, but I am OOC hopeful the event will make it make sense to call on Ixion. OOC I am thrilled the admin are willing to look at everything that happened and decide that the numbers were incredibly close, both sides were really good and had prepared quite a bit, and while Parhelion won and his alliance came out tops, it really is difficult to know the outcome had the lag been even half as bad. Even if we all had been fighting in the same lag I experienced early on, which was maybe around 5sec lag instead of the minutes+ that was experienced.
So many players on our side really were crushed by the outcome more than usual because of the lag. This is a lovely morale boost and I'm not sure how it OOC takes away from the winning side. I am 100% sympathetic to the IC, as again, I'm not sure how Lief will react. But I really do feel that OOC it is a phenomenal gesture that our current admin will take responsibility and work to improve it for next year.
Amazing beautiful stunning avatar by Gurashi! ~ A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest." ~ Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
"Chairwoman," Princess Setisoki states, holding up a hand in a gesture for her to stop and returning the cup. "That would be quite inappropriate. One of the males will serve me."
So many players on our side really were crushed by the outcome more than usual because of the lag. This is a lovely morale boost and I'm not sure how it OOC takes away from the winning side. I am 100% sympathetic to the IC, as again, I'm not sure how Lief will react. But I really do feel that OOC it is a phenomenal gesture that our current admin will take responsibility and work to improve it for next year.
I think others have said, throughout this thread, why it diminishes the winning side... but there are a lot of posts at this point.
Basically, boil it down to this.
Two teams make it to the finals. Whether it be the World Series, Stanley Cup, World Cup- you have two teams out on the field with a huge amount invested, emotionally, in the challenge.
The field is a ruined mess. The game isn't called, but everyone is running, slipping, sliding through the mud.
Instead of calling the game, though, on it goes.
It is hard-fought, but when the time ticks down there is a winner. The cup is given to the winning team. But then, a couple of days later, the sport's authorities decree that they are making a second cup, exactly the same, and providing it to the other team.
Imagine the feelings of the first at this point, the emotions. This is the ultimate prize of their sport. They won it. Circumstances entirely beyond their control affected the outcome, but because the game continued regardless they pushed on despite that... the joy, the euphoria of overcoming the odds and making the comeback win.
And now, they are told that the thing they competed for is just being duplicated and handed over to the other team- the thing they fought so hard to attain, the recognition that they prevailed, is now diminished to a participation trophy.
That is why it feels like it takes away.
Is it the right call in the context of a game that is simply not in the category of e-sports? Possibly- if they are attempting to convert the game to be something less competitive, less us v. them, then sure. But that is not how the event was billed, or until this post was made two days later. Up until that point the event was the ultimate challenge, Lusternia's version of the World Series. Acknowledging that, and accounting for that as well, is fair.
So many players on our side really were crushed by the outcome more than usual because of the lag. This is a lovely morale boost and I'm not sure how it OOC takes away from the winning side. I am 100% sympathetic to the IC, as again, I'm not sure how Lief will react. But I really do feel that OOC it is a phenomenal gesture that our current admin will take responsibility and work to improve it for next year.
I think others have said, throughout this thread, why it diminishes the winning side... but there are a lot of posts at this point.
Basically, boil it down to this.
Two teams make it to the finals. Whether it be the World Series, Stanley Cup, World Cup- you have two teams out on the field with a huge amount invested, emotionally, in the challenge.
The field is a ruined mess. The game isn't called, but everyone is running, slipping, sliding through the mud.
Instead of calling the game, though, on it goes.
It is hard-fought, but when the time ticks down there is a winner. The cup is given to the winning team. But then, a couple of days later, the sport's authorities decree that they are making a second cup, exactly the same, and providing it to the other team.
Imagine the feelings of the first at this point, the emotions. This is the ultimate prize of their sport. They won it. Circumstances entirely beyond their control affected the outcome, but because the game continued regardless they pushed on despite that... the joy, the euphoria of overcoming the odds and making the comeback win.
And now, they are told that the thing they competed for is just being duplicated and handed over to the other team- the thing they fought so hard to attain, the recognition that they prevailed, is now diminished to a participation trophy.
That is why it feels like it takes away.
Is it the right call in the context of a game that is simply not in the category of e-sports? Possibly- if they are attempting to convert the game to be something less competitive, less us v. them, then sure. But that is not how the event was billed, or until this post was made two days later. Up until that point the event was the ultimate challenge, Lusternia's version of the World Series. Acknowledging that, and accounting for that as well, is fair.
I have been reading along, and I fully read that people are upset. I don't understand it because this game isn't one where the prize is IRL money that is on the line - your livelihood isn't potentially at stake, like it could be in your example. Like someone else posted, Ixion will always have an asterisk by his name and Parhelion won't. The real victory is yours, and I am hopeful that the event reflects that, but I really do feel it is in part victory over the lag, not over the other side.
Holding this event is a gesture of kindness and goodwill, especially when the TF we received felt hollow even to me (I realize it was meant to be an apology, and after things cooled a bit but before the announcement I could understand it for what it was, but while people were reeling OOC, it unintentionally hurt people.)
From my understanding, the call was made so delayed because of OOC circumstances and a full day's driving between the end of Ascension and settling in enough to try to figure out the best thing to do. I do understand how the delay in a decision might leave people feeling confused and hurt, but that sounds like something where real life interfered as it can do. They were working with a lot of precedence as well - I personally am on the side that thinks it would have been most fair to delay as well, as I believe I remember you being, but I imagine it's hard to make that snap decision in the moment. I am, however, grateful that they aren't saying "Well, hindsight is 20/20, nothing we can do now, sorry kids".
I had been seeing people speaking to why they were upset OOC - because their characters' IC motivations were being trampled on, and I don't think that's how the event will play out. I wanted to post to express my point of view pertaining to that, as Lief was secretly breathing a sigh of relief that despite giving it her all, Creation was ultimately protected by someone who wasn't undead.
Amazing beautiful stunning avatar by Gurashi! ~ A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest." ~ Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
I think it is a fair point to say that the competition did not involve $ (that I know of, at least). This has not always been the case. Final Ascension challenges in the past actually have had seal holders requesting significant Paypal donations for support- personally this feels extremely metagamey, but perhaps the mere fact that it has happened helps you understand how invested players are / think others are in the outcome.
Beyond that, though, a competition does not need to involve money to be treated as a competition. There is the prestige involved in gaining something that is a "limited-time offer," for example.
A question for you at this point: if Ixion was raised TA, but something else minor was done to acknowledge Choros' win in addition to that, would that offend you? Would you be as demoralized as you say you were after the event ended?
I think it is a fair point to say that the competition did not involve $ (that I know of, at least). This has not always been the case. Final Ascension challenges in the past actually have had seal holders requesting significant Paypal donations for support- personally this feels extremely metagamey, but perhaps the mere fact that it has happened helps you understand how invested players are / think others are in the outcome.
Beyond that, though, a competition does not need to involve money to be treated as a competition. There is the prestige involved in gaining something that is a "limited-time offer," for example.
A question for you at this point: if Ixion was raised TA, but something else minor was done to acknowledge Choros' win in addition to that, would that offend you? Would you be as demoralized as you say you were after the event ended?
Oh wow - I didn't know that first point has happened in the past.
For your question, I 100% would not be offended if something minor was done to acknowledge Choros/Parhelion being the real victor because that is what happened. If he got a special honors line, a special item, a special typecast - I'm not sure what else might be minor but still be recognition, but I would not only be okay with that - I would be happy about it.
Amazing beautiful stunning avatar by Gurashi! ~ A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest." ~ Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
I decided to go to bed early last night because my responses were not relaying what I was attempting to convey.
I think the main issue here is that I'm coming from a different perspective than everyone else. We're attempting a solution that takes everyone into consideration and people are speaking from their personal perspective and not the game as a whole. That's on me for not portraying things properly.
I'm not against doing something small to acknowledge Parhelion, but I think there's a distinct difference between that and doing something like giving a Demigod power only accessible to one alliance.
(Also, who asks for Paypal donations for Ascension? I've not heard of that, that's crazy, I'm certainly not a fan of that and hope people aren't feeling obliged to contribute - this is off topic and don't continue this line of commenting though, I'm asking rhetorically.)
I think it is a fair point to say that the competition did not involve $ (that I know of, at least). This has not always been the case. Final Ascension challenges in the past actually have had seal holders requesting significant Paypal donations for support- personally this feels extremely metagamey, but perhaps the mere fact that it has happened helps you understand how invested players are / think others are in the outcome.
Beyond that, though, a competition does not need to involve money to be treated as a competition. There is the prestige involved in gaining something that is a "limited-time offer," for example.
A question for you at this point: if Ixion was raised TA, but something else minor was done to acknowledge Choros' win in addition to that, would that offend you? Would you be as demoralized as you say you were after the event ended?
Woah woah, who and when did this happen? That seems like something that should have been brought up in years past, why didn't it?
Why not give Parhelion an additional Honour Line? If Ascension does change in the future, this can be retroactively changed to state he was the Last True Ascendant to be raised or something in this ballpark. I am sure he would appreciate it and @Xenthos can feel better knowing it will be an honour line that Ixion cannot ever receive and Ixion's TA will be diminished in some form.
It's been three days... why are we still continuing to make this such a big deal? Just drop it and move on. There are more important things to concern yourself with than this. Like you know... how we could possibly change Ascension to make it a bit better in the long run so this entire 'I hate you, so I'm going to do everything I can to stop you from Ascending' stuff can just not be a thing. Just... sheesh. It's sad that this has to come from a guy who barely knows anything about the game itself.
Edit: I'm just going to stop. This needs entire thread just needs to die down.
Imagine the feelings of the first at this point, the emotions. This is the ultimate prize of their sport. They won it. Circumstances entirely beyond their control affected the outcome, but because the game continued regardless they pushed on despite that... the joy, the euphoria of overcoming the odds and making the comeback win.
That's not a comeback win. Circumstances beyond your control affecting the outcome means that the outcome was beyond your control. If the outcome had not favored you I doubt you'd be pleased with the result. It's the same as complaining that certain skills/combinations are OP - if they are, in fact, OP, then it's not the fault of the ones who are fighting against it whether they win or lose. It's the fault of the admin for not making the playing field fair. No offense to Orael or anyone else, because hindsight is 20/20.
There's not really many real-life comparisons to online lag. If the goal in your scenario was to win the game despite the odds, then that could be a valid competition(though it sounds unsafe). But server responses don't affect everyone equally at all times, as would be the case on a bad playing field.
"Chairwoman," Princess Setisoki states, holding up a hand in a gesture for her to stop and returning the cup. "That would be quite inappropriate. One of the males will serve me."
I've taken a few days to cool down from the announcement post, because I was upset and honestly angry and I wanted to walk away and explore why I was feeling that way. Now I'm going to post this as a caveat before I get tainted with being toxic. I have nothing OOC against Ixion, I don't know him.
The Seal of Time, damaged from the hiccup, needs repairing. But it's too soon for another full Trial of Ascension. Avechna decides that this must be sudden death. Parhelion and two companions must face off against Ixion (/whatever his TA name will be) and his two companions. The two teams will be on Astral by themselves, where they must fight once more for the Staff. Since this is a quick-and-dirty Trial, they only need to race to 1800 (only Ixion and Parhelion can get points, but their companions can run for the Staff).
Firstly this is a horrendous idea . In theory it does sound amazing, but you are pitting one of the best PK'ers off against someone who PK's because they have to. The RP behind it is sound, but the actual application means that Ixion wins (My opinion).
Okay so why was I upset by this? I agree that lag was a massive issue for both sides during Ascension, and it was the worst lag we have had during the event. What I feel is being massively brushed under the carpet here by a lot of people is the following:
1) Celest/Glom/Halli has 2 seal bearers. This means we had one person who could be a runner, and one person who was able to run for the staff. With a few Hail Mary's Ciaran managed to grab the staff on several occasions. This is before six other people who were able to act as runners grabbed it. This was while both teams were fighting with lag. Now if Mag/Seren/Gaudi choose not to allow all of their other seal bearers baring Ixion to be runners, that's really down to them.
To clearly lay out my thoughts, this is like the finals of the premier league football. IHC had all 11 players on the field. Equinox had 6 players. With just them 6 they managed to win. Ref decides that the ground was too wet and everyone was slipping over on both sides. So we're going to just award the trophy to both sides this year.
2) OOCly I only cared who won Ascension based on sides. This isn't because I didn't want Ixion to be ascended, I didn't want my team losing. It could have been anyone on IHC's side up for TA, my feelings wouldn't have changed. Like many I see this as a competitive sport. ICly Aknarin is going to be crushed by the idea that someone from Magnagora and is Tainted is also becoming a TA. As the Queen of Celest, her duty to the Supernals, the Citizens, the Tide Lords, Divine etc etc is to stop the Tainted and remove them from the Basin of Life... this is just another step further away from it.
3) I don't feel a RP event for both sides helps to negate the negative feelings this decision has fostered within Equinox. Of course everyone is IHC is going to rave about how good it is, you're also getting something etc. A special event for Equinox in my honest opinion will not in any way, shape or form make them feel equal. I honestly don't have a solution that hasn't been suggested by @Xenthos or others during this thread, which isn't very helpful I know and I'm sorry. I'm just stating the fact.
Feel free to call me whatever you wish, but I honestly feel that IHC are always going to say 'this is good, accept it, stop being toxic' because generally they are benefitting from this. I also feel Equinox are going to push for something until they're blue in the face, because although people are saying "we're not taking anything away from you" you are giving the side that did not win the top prize.
I would really prefer not to be given anything extra, thanks. I'm not interested in being that ascendant who got a bonus because his opponent was so close, and I dont want to be the guy people point at next year and say, "He got this, why dont I get it?!?!?!"
Her voice firm and commanding, Terentia, the Even Bladed says to you, "You have kept your oath to Me, Parhelion. You have sworn to maintain Justice in these troubled times."
Yet if a boon be granted me, unworthy as I am, let it be for a steady hand with a clear eye and a fury most inflaming.
I would really prefer not to be given anything extra, thanks. I'm not interested in being that ascendant who got a bonus because his opponent was so close, and I dont want to be the guy people point at next year and say, "He got this, why dont I get it?!?!?!"
I hear you, and for the record I think you've been an incredibly gracious winner.
But consider Terentia or someone else giving Parhelion some kind of cool and unique token because of this. :x
(I'm kidding. Kinda. Your wishes should 100% be respected though.)
Amazing beautiful stunning avatar by Gurashi! ~ A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest." ~ Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
One thing that appears we did not communicate clearly is that the event tomorrow is not just for Ixion and Mag/Gaudu/Seren. The event is for both sides and for everyone to take part in and enjoy.
Again, we apologize if that wasn't clear from the beginning.
One thing that appears we did not communicate clearly is that the event tomorrow is not just for Ixion and Mag/Gaudu/Seren. The event is for both sides and for everyone to take part in and enjoy.
Again, we apologize if that wasn't clear from the beginning.
We were ready to barge our way in anyway!
"One can choose to go back toward safety or forward toward growth.
Growth must be chosen again and again; fear must be overcome again and
again."
One thing that appears we did not communicate clearly is that the event tomorrow is not just for Ixion and Mag/Gaudu/Seren. The event is for both sides and for everyone to take part in and enjoy.
Again, we apologize if that wasn't clear from the beginning.
Is Ixion guaranteed to be the one to benefit from it? Then it's for them.
I'm Lucidian. If I don't get pedantic every so often, I might explode.
This is my first time posting on here in any capacity, so please bear with me on this. I have been reading these responses from everyone here, and no one here on Equinox's side (from what it seems) is honestly taking Parhelion's feelings into play. He, the TA, the one who claimed the staff for your side, wishes for this to occur, and yet everyone seems to only put their own feelings first. I know each and every one of you fought hard to win, and so too did the IHC. Although, due to the horrible lag, that by many of your accounts was the worst in the games history (I wouldn't personally know as this was my first ascension event), kept things from playing out in an even fashion. The Admin here have apologized to the players entirely, and had the roles been reversed (Ixion claiming the staff, and Choros losing due to the lag), I'm almost positive the Admin would have come to the same conclusion and offered the same thing.
Of the players that I have personally spoken to ICly, on both sides of the fence, each has stated that they felt as though the event was...less than satisfactory, and each side was cheated out of a solid victory. Parhelion has by far, been the most understanding, and honorable person on here. What everyone seems to not also see, is the point of view of Orael and the other Admin. They are indeed trying their best to accommodate every player the best way they know how, and all everyone seems to want to do is whine about how what they're wishing for isn't fair, or you should have done this or that. In my most humble opinion, they're ADMINISTRATORS, they honestly could have done whatever they wanted to do without ever telling anyone here their intentions, and let you all whine about it later. Yet, they were upfront with all of us, as transparent as they could be. As what was said earlier "Hindsight is 20/20" a truer statement couldn't have been said. During the event, they did what they could to disable things in order to try and rectify the lad as best they could, and yes, while they could have postponed the event in order to work out all of the kinks that were apparently discussed in the Discord, they decided to push forward.
No matter what was decided on the Administrations end, someone was going to end up with hurt feelings of some sort. So, ultimately, what I guess I'm trying to say is, instead of us all bickering with one another about this isn't fair for us, or crap like that. Why don't we sit back and acknowledge the individuals that the -directly- involves. Yes, it involves us all indirectly, but this ultimately is under the control of the Admin, Parhelion, and Ixion. So, get out of your feelings people, and just go with it and enjoy whatever event that the Admin is trying to put together for ALL of us.
So, I've let curiosity get the better of me and scanned a few pages of this thread. I wish people would just leave it well enough alone. Here's my idea that piggybacks off some other ideas.
This Saturday, Magnagora raises Ixion as VA, which is well earned not only given his hard work in the Ascension but his time and service to the Engine. A wild backlash of power from Avechna, stemming from the "points" Ixion earned during Ascension, refunds the amount of power used to raise him in its entirety.
The admin get to roleplay it out.
IHC get an ascendant, and let's be serious, one unlikely to ever be lowered. If they do, it's a crapton of free power.
SL gets their one true ascendant.
We still lost Ciaran
I have listened to what Parhelion has said and fully agree with it.
One thing that appears we did not communicate clearly is that the event tomorrow is not just for Ixion and Mag/Gaudu/Seren. The event is for both sides and for everyone to take part in and enjoy.
Again, we apologize if that wasn't clear from the beginning.
Is Ixion guaranteed to be the one to benefit from it? Then it's for them.
Saving creation from the soulless gods is for everyone[spoiler], even if they're stinky Kethuru-touched Magnagorans.[/spoiler]
Oh no, my spoiler tag doesn't work
Her voice firm and commanding, Terentia, the Even Bladed says to you, "You have kept your oath to Me, Parhelion. You have sworn to maintain Justice in these troubled times."
Yet if a boon be granted me, unworthy as I am, let it be for a steady hand with a clear eye and a fury most inflaming.
One thing that appears we did not communicate clearly is that the event tomorrow is not just for Ixion and Mag/Gaudu/Seren. The event is for both sides and for everyone to take part in and enjoy.
Again, we apologize if that wasn't clear from the beginning.
Is Ixion guaranteed to be the one to benefit from it? Then it's for them.
Saving creation from the soulless gods is for everyone[spoiler], even if they're stinky Kethuru-touched Magnagorans.[/spoiler]
Oh no, my spoiler tag doesn't work
Saving the basin from Kethuru is just as much for Magnagorans as True Ascension is for the Sealbearer who kept the Staff of Ascension on a node on Astral for 3600 seconds during Ascension.
I'm Lucidian. If I don't get pedantic every so often, I might explode.
Can someone push the button that lets my retirement go through? I can't put this burnout mess behind me until someone does the thing that lets me leave.
Can someone push the button that lets my retirement go through? I can't put this burnout mess behind me until someone does the thing that lets me leave.
I would also appreciate if the admin could finish the retirement process on Ciaran. It would help grant some finality and closure.
All retirements have been pushed through at this point.
We were waiting to confirm them as retirement is a permanent decision and we wanted to make sure that people were not making any decisions they would come to later regret. We do regret that this decision led anyone to retire.
Additionally - we feel this thread has run it's course, so we'll be closing it now.
When we first announced this - Parhelion received a lot of grief almost to the point of retirement and I announced that those of you that may have contributed to that should be ashamed of yourselves.
Two other players announced here that they also were going to retire. Unfortunately, they did not change their minds. The people that decided to react with 'LOL' to them asking their retirements to be finalized should feel ashamed of themselves as well.
This is the toxicity and OOC hatred we need to get away from - we all play this game to get away from reality and escape, whether it be mastering of combat and coding or to enjoy the RP and flavour of our beautiful world. This is a conflict game, and conflict is inevitable, but we can still maintain a level of respect and decency towards each other, which will only serve to enhance and grow the game overall.
Even if you disagree with their reasoning for retiring, we shouldn't be 'laughing' them out the door. We can do better than that.
Comments
Parhelion is our TA now. The Seals were repaired. But, the "new" Seal of Time, still slightly out of synch with the others, hiccups, and an alternate timeline crashes into ours: a timeline wherein Ixion won and took TA. Their Ixion absorbs our Ixion, so now we just have TA Ixion (who is still Ixion the player).
The Seal of Time, damaged from the hiccup, needs repairing. But it's too soon for another full Trial of Ascension. Avechna decides that this must be sudden death. Parhelion and two companions must face off against Ixion (/whatever his TA name will be) and his two companions. The two teams will be on Astral by themselves, where they must fight once more for the Staff. Since this is a quick-and-dirty Trial, they only need to race to 1800 (only Ixion and Parhelion can get points, but their companions can run for the Staff).
Someone wins. Avechna blesses that TA again. As a consequence of two consecutive Trials in such a short span of time, the rest of the Seals get extra-strong and are now immune from being broken. Kethuru is now permanently trapped beyond Astral, yahoo! The line of True Ascendants is broken, and a new line begins: the Ascendants of Time, with the first one being whoever wins the quickie Final Trial. The Big Bads will now be threats from other timelines (keeping with the overall theme that Lusternia has been going since last year, with timequakes and anomalies and such).
Explorer (80%), Achiever (53%), Socializer (53%), Killer (13%)
Bartle Taxonomy
(test yourself)
And I am not sure how to convey it. But I think your post is important, especially the bits I clipped out here.
Seren leadership has had a lot on their OOC plates. When it came time to support someone for TA, Gaudiguch wanted to support Dys and Magnagora wanted to support Ixion, and Serenwilde was the tie-breaking vote. We voted together as a commune when we had a high enough population to have a semi-fair representation of what characters wanted, and while Ixion overwhelmingly won the vote, my character Lief was one of two to voice support for someone who wouldn't be undead. She noted that while she would fight for Creation and honor the alliance's wishes, since Serenwilde had the opportunity, she thought it would be best to support someone she could feel good about supporting.
IC, I'm not fully sure how she will react to someone undead gaining TA, but I am OOC hopeful the event will make it make sense to call on Ixion. OOC I am thrilled the admin are willing to look at everything that happened and decide that the numbers were incredibly close, both sides were really good and had prepared quite a bit, and while Parhelion won and his alliance came out tops, it really is difficult to know the outcome had the lag been even half as bad. Even if we all had been fighting in the same lag I experienced early on, which was maybe around 5sec lag instead of the minutes+ that was experienced.
So many players on our side really were crushed by the outcome more than usual because of the lag. This is a lovely morale boost and I'm not sure how it OOC takes away from the winning side. I am 100% sympathetic to the IC, as again, I'm not sure how Lief will react. But I really do feel that OOC it is a phenomenal gesture that our current admin will take responsibility and work to improve it for next year.
~
A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest."
~
Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
Holding this event is a gesture of kindness and goodwill, especially when the TF we received felt hollow even to me (I realize it was meant to be an apology, and after things cooled a bit but before the announcement I could understand it for what it was, but while people were reeling OOC, it unintentionally hurt people.)
From my understanding, the call was made so delayed because of OOC circumstances and a full day's driving between the end of Ascension and settling in enough to try to figure out the best thing to do. I do understand how the delay in a decision might leave people feeling confused and hurt, but that sounds like something where real life interfered as it can do. They were working with a lot of precedence as well - I personally am on the side that thinks it would have been most fair to delay as well, as I believe I remember you being, but I imagine it's hard to make that snap decision in the moment. I am, however, grateful that they aren't saying "Well, hindsight is 20/20, nothing we can do now, sorry kids".
I had been seeing people speaking to why they were upset OOC - because their characters' IC motivations were being trampled on, and I don't think that's how the event will play out. I wanted to post to express my point of view pertaining to that, as Lief was secretly breathing a sigh of relief that despite giving it her all, Creation was ultimately protected by someone who wasn't undead.
~
A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest."
~
Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
For your question, I 100% would not be offended if something minor was done to acknowledge Choros/Parhelion being the real victor because that is what happened. If he got a special honors line, a special item, a special typecast - I'm not sure what else might be minor but still be recognition, but I would not only be okay with that - I would be happy about it.
~
A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest."
~
Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
I think the main issue here is that I'm coming from a different perspective than everyone else. We're attempting a solution that takes everyone into consideration and people are speaking from their personal perspective and not the game as a whole. That's on me for not portraying things properly.
I'm not against doing something small to acknowledge Parhelion, but I think there's a distinct difference between that and doing something like giving a Demigod power only accessible to one alliance.
(Also, who asks for Paypal donations for Ascension? I've not heard of that, that's crazy, I'm certainly not a fan of that and hope people aren't feeling obliged to contribute - this is off topic and don't continue this line of commenting though, I'm asking rhetorically.)
Why not give Parhelion an additional Honour Line? If Ascension does change in the future, this can be retroactively changed to state he was the Last True Ascendant to be raised or something in this ballpark. I am sure he would appreciate it and @Xenthos can feel better knowing it will be an honour line that Ixion cannot ever receive and Ixion's TA will be diminished in some form.
Edit: I'm just going to stop. This needs entire thread just needs to die down.
Imagine the feelings of the first at this point, the emotions. This is the ultimate prize of their sport. They won it. Circumstances entirely beyond their control affected the outcome, but because the game continued regardless they pushed on despite that... the joy, the euphoria of overcoming the odds and making the comeback win.
There's not really many real-life comparisons to online lag. If the goal in your scenario was to win the game despite the odds, then that could be a valid competition(though it sounds unsafe). But server responses don't affect everyone equally at all times, as would be the case on a bad playing field.
I've taken a few days to cool down from the announcement post, because I was upset and honestly angry and I wanted to walk away and explore why I was feeling that way. Now I'm going to post this as a caveat before I get tainted with being toxic. I have nothing OOC against Ixion, I don't know him.
Firstly this is a horrendous idea
Okay so why was I upset by this? I agree that lag was a massive issue for both sides during Ascension, and it was the worst lag we have had during the event. What I feel is being massively brushed under the carpet here by a lot of people is the following:
1) Celest/Glom/Halli has 2 seal bearers. This means we had one person who could be a runner, and one person who was able to run for the staff. With a few Hail Mary's Ciaran managed to grab the staff on several occasions. This is before six other people who were able to act as runners grabbed it. This was while both teams were fighting with lag. Now if Mag/Seren/Gaudi choose not to allow all of their other seal bearers baring Ixion to be runners, that's really down to them.
To clearly lay out my thoughts, this is like the finals of the premier league football. IHC had all 11 players on the field. Equinox had 6 players. With just them 6 they managed to win. Ref decides that the ground was too wet and everyone was slipping over on both sides. So we're going to just award the trophy to both sides this year.
2) OOCly I only cared who won Ascension based on sides. This isn't because I didn't want Ixion to be ascended, I didn't want my team losing. It could have been anyone on IHC's side up for TA, my feelings wouldn't have changed. Like many I see this as a competitive sport. ICly Aknarin is going to be crushed by the idea that someone from Magnagora and is Tainted is also becoming a TA. As the Queen of Celest, her duty to the Supernals, the Citizens, the Tide Lords, Divine etc etc is to stop the Tainted and remove them from the Basin of Life... this is just another step further away from it.
3) I don't feel a RP event for both sides helps to negate the negative feelings this decision has fostered within Equinox. Of course everyone is IHC is going to rave about how good it is, you're also getting something etc. A special event for Equinox in my honest opinion will not in any way, shape or form make them feel equal. I honestly don't have a solution that hasn't been suggested by @Xenthos or others during this thread, which isn't very helpful I know and I'm sorry. I'm just stating the fact.
Feel free to call me whatever you wish, but I honestly feel that IHC are always going to say 'this is good, accept it, stop being toxic' because generally they are benefitting from this. I also feel Equinox are going to push for something until they're blue in the face, because although people are saying "we're not taking anything away from you" you are giving the side that did not win the top prize.
But consider Terentia or someone else giving Parhelion some kind of cool and unique token because of this. :x
(I'm kidding. Kinda. Your wishes should 100% be respected though.)
~
A gentle breeze ruffles your wings and whispers in your ears, as if for you alone, "Dragonfly's words shine... seeds, sown and tended, inspire... a forest harvest."
~
Maylea reaches out, Her fingers poised in midair. "Now you are of Me, even more than you were before." Her golden and azure eyes glitter. "Walk well, Eldin. Shed glory in My name, and bring life to the lifeless."
Again, we apologize if that wasn't clear from the beginning.
We were ready to barge our way in anyway!
Of the players that I have personally spoken to ICly, on both sides of the fence, each has stated that they felt as though the event was...less than satisfactory, and each side was cheated out of a solid victory. Parhelion has by far, been the most understanding, and honorable person on here. What everyone seems to not also see, is the point of view of Orael and the other Admin. They are indeed trying their best to accommodate every player the best way they know how, and all everyone seems to want to do is whine about how what they're wishing for isn't fair, or you should have done this or that. In my most humble opinion, they're ADMINISTRATORS, they honestly could have done whatever they wanted to do without ever telling anyone here their intentions, and let you all whine about it later. Yet, they were upfront with all of us, as transparent as they could be. As what was said earlier "Hindsight is 20/20" a truer statement couldn't have been said. During the event, they did what they could to disable things in order to try and rectify the lad as best they could, and yes, while they could have postponed the event in order to work out all of the kinks that were apparently discussed in the Discord, they decided to push forward.
No matter what was decided on the Administrations end, someone was going to end up with hurt feelings of some sort. So, ultimately, what I guess I'm trying to say is, instead of us all bickering with one another about this isn't fair for us, or crap like that. Why don't we sit back and acknowledge the individuals that the -directly- involves. Yes, it involves us all indirectly, but this ultimately is under the control of the Admin, Parhelion, and Ixion. So, get out of your feelings people, and just go with it and enjoy whatever event that the Admin is trying to put together for ALL of us.
Saving creation from the soulless gods is for everyone[spoiler], even if they're stinky Kethuru-touched Magnagorans.[/spoiler]
Oh no, my spoiler tag doesn't work
Edit: Thanks
We were waiting to confirm them as retirement is a permanent decision and we wanted to make sure that people were not making any decisions they would come to later regret. We do regret that this decision led anyone to retire.
Additionally - we feel this thread has run it's course, so we'll be closing it now.
When we first announced this - Parhelion received a lot of grief almost to the point of retirement and I announced that those of you that may have contributed to that should be ashamed of yourselves.
Two other players announced here that they also were going to retire. Unfortunately, they did not change their minds. The people that decided to react with 'LOL' to them asking their retirements to be finalized should feel ashamed of themselves as well.
This is the toxicity and OOC hatred we need to get away from - we all play this game to get away from reality and escape, whether it be mastering of combat and coding or to enjoy the RP and flavour of our beautiful world. This is a conflict game, and conflict is inevitable, but we can still maintain a level of respect and decency towards each other, which will only serve to enhance and grow the game overall.
Even if you disagree with their reasoning for retiring, we shouldn't be 'laughing' them out the door. We can do better than that.