What's the dealio, Serenwilde?

Okpara

I don't know if this is in the right spot! If it's not, please move it or delete it and tell me where to repost it or whatever I need to do.

So I'm here to complain about something. Not here to get a change in game, there's probably stuff going on, just here to vent about a couple things.

First I had to remake my forum account which is super lame.  

Second is this experience that's been my weekend on my monky Lusternian so far. I was recently convinced to give Serenwilde a go by a couple of old (Seren) friends. I didn't want to make a new character and start over, so I dusted off good ol' Okpara who I haven't played seriously in something like five years. Like when the Wheel of Tzarazazaza was just put out and was throwing artifacts and credits and blessings just all over the place. I've got a Torus and a couple decent stat boosts, man, I don't want to give that up. So I sign on, quit Celest, and meander over to Serenwilde to get the lay of the land and get myself some Nature Goodness(tm). I figure I'll RP this like Okpara's been meditating for years and reached this conclusion that Nature was the bestest. I was gonna play it by ear. This is a log and I guess it's kinda long.

DAAAYYYYYY ONE

(This begins with me setting up post right at the Moonhart Mother Tree so as to attract that highest degree of attention possible. I then bother the first person I see.)

You click your mandibles together energetically, chittering to yourself.

You say to Sarrasri, "Hello."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to you, "Greetings."

You say to Sarrasri, "I have undergone something of a change of heart concering my being."

Sarrasri tilts her head curiously at you.

You say to Sarrasri, "I've long been a part of Celest, if slumbering, and much of my time has been 

spent seeking a peace of being I could not acquire. I am... was, a Tahtetso. I understand that the 

guild is no more."

Flicking a curious green, Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "I see. And 

so you are in search of your path, once more."

You have emoted: Okpara bows low and forms a circular image with his hands, antennae whirring 

rapidly in the air atop his skull. After a pause, he says, "That is correct."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt asks, "Am I to take it then, that you do 

not believe Celest to be your home anymore?"

After making several clicking noises with his jaw, you say to Sarrasri, "That is correct. I do not 

possess such a thing any longer. It is difficult to locate the peace of mind and self when 

surrounded by brick and mortar. I have learned this."

Sarrasri's colour shifts to a calm blue as she clasps her hands in front of her. "So you wish to 

join the forest, and seek peace in a more open setting?" She softly smiles as she continues, "If 

that is the case, I would not blame you."

You have emoted: Okpara's many-faceted eyes swivel in their sockets for a moment.

You say, "I wish to... learn. Of nature."

Sarrasri nods. "I see."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "I must meditate a short while. Think 

on what it is you truly wish, and when I return, we can discuss further."

You nod your head at Sarrasri.

(Well that was easy! I'll just hang out a bit and wait for her to get back and induct me. I stand at the Moonhart like some kind of jerkwad for roughly twenty minutes or so before I decide to bother more people.)

You say, "Is this normal?"

Your mandibles twitch slightly as you voice a brief, curious chirr.

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt asks you, "Is what normal?"

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Glom jumping none combatants in faethorn, me getting some 

revenge by invading glom village with orcs then them deciding to try and kill me?"

You say, "Letting a stranger stand at the heart of your forest."

Gwirodydd says, "Are you an enemy?"

Comprehension flashes across Urdnot's face.

Gwirodydd squints suspiciously at her surroundings.

You say to Gwirodydd, "Am I an ally?"

Gwirodydd shrugs helplessly.

You click your mandibles together energetically, chittering to yourself.

Gwirodydd says, "Everyone is an ally until they give me a reason to be an enemy. Then it's power, 

right in the kisser."

Orimi Ladyn whispers to Gwirodydd, "I believe he's old, perhaps senile."

Gwirodydd says to you, "I think you're an ally, sure."

Sarrasri takes a deep breath as the crystal surface of her face softens and shifts in colour, a 

muted glow appearing within.

(She snuck up on me. I didn't even realize she was back)

You say to Gwirodydd, "And what do you base that on?"

Gwirodydd says, "You haven't attacked me yet."

Gwirodydd shrugs helplessly.

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "You are of Celest or recently of Celest and you haven't done 

anything to make us think you shouldn't still be an ally."

Gwirodydd says, "Of course, I also don't like being questioned in my own home, so that may change. 

Can we help you?"

(I do an Honors thing and see Gwir's only 18. I'm not gonna get sassed by a wee bab. Why aren't these people suspicious of me at all? It's madness!)

You have emoted: Okpara whirs about to face Urdnot for an instant before his cobalt eyes find 

Gwirodydd once again. "The child does not enjoy being questioned. Unfortunate. They should be 

curious most of all."

You say to Urdnot, "What makes you say that?"

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Say what?

You say, "That I am of Celest."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Brother title."

"A child should question, not be questioned. I don't know you from any other kephera, yet here you 

are." Gwirodydd replies, frowning at you. "You stand at the Moonhart Mother, asking us why we 

haven't asked you to leave yet. For all I know, you're wyrden and nobody knows who you are. But, I 

can't attack you, because that's rude."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Graduate of Empyreal."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Ankhemet hive."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "And you said earlier that you woke up to find the Tahetso guild 

gone."

(Oh hey he actually checked into me a bit, great!)

You smile and say, "While any could bestow a title of Brother, I am told that those of Magnagora 

bestow similar markings of status. I am pleased to see at least one person here using their 

faculties to some extent."

You say to Gwirodydd, "And if you think children should not be questioned, I fear for your future."

Gwirodydd says to you, "Did you come here to insult us, or merely pass judgement on our people for 

not knowing who you are?"

You smile and say, "I am nobody."

Sarrasri turns to face you, her lips upturned in a cheery smile. "Have you thought more on nature 

and your future path?"

You say, "Though, yes, I am here to determine something for myself and test you accordingly."

Barrin Strongleaf says to Gwirodydd, "Would you like to come hunt with us?"

Gwirodydd drops the corpses in her hands at the foot of the nearby shrine, watching them turn into 

so much dust and collapse out of existence. "Or perhaps the wisdom of going to another's home and 

questioning them?" she whispers, turning to Barrin. "Sure, I'd love to come!"

You have emoted: Okpara moves his jaw rapidly to and fro, a soft buzzing sound resulting thereof. 

Another series of soft clicking noises come before he responds. "I... have. I have pondered your 

forest. I am curious as to how this exists at all".

A sparkle in her eye, Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to you, "Nature 

perseveres, with our without us. Most of us just choose to go with her."

You say to Sarrasri, "And you don't believe that your nature requires protection?"

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to you, "Of course I do, and I do 

everything I can to assist nature. However, the Wheel continues to turn and move forward, with or 

without my help."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Don't suppose anyone has the pearl sandals rare?"

Sarrasri looks up to the sky, a shimmer passing along her skin. "Everything I do is either for the 

forest or for my Lord." She looks back down and towards you. "The only reason I'm bothering to talk 

with you, honestly, is because you're considering a path outside of the city."

Urdnot rolls his eyes.

Chirring softly, his voice a low and gravely effort, you say to Sarrasri, "When I was younger, 

simply walking into the Serenwilde evoked vigorous questioning of purpose. I just find it strange 

that I am free to wander about without so much as a second glance. Relations must be much stronger 

than they used to be."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "It is something that would not have 

happened many many moons ago, I admit."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "The alliances seem to have opened 

the borders of the forest quite a bit, and broadened the comfort zone of many."

You say to Sarrasri, "Alliances or no, such an odd turn of events. I am hypocritical in this, but 

this is not the Serenwilde I expected to find."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to Sarrasri, "What'd he expect to 

find?"

You say, "Laysus A wilde that would question my presence within it, to start."

(TO LAYSUS, ugh.)

You cough softly.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "Well, life is full of 

surprises."

Your mandibles twitch slightly as you voice a brief, curious chirr.

You say, "Yes."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Just because we are allies now does 

not mean we forget the past and what Celest has done to us before."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Surprising isn't it?"

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to Sarrasri, "Do you remember how 

ultimately it was the war with Celest that drove my wife Sivriel from us?"

Sarrasri nods her head.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "And my dear protege, Tatine, we lost 

her to their rampant aggression too."

Laysus sucks thoughtfully on his teeth.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "And how when we were allies with them 

before they would make non-aggression treaties with our enemies in Glomdoring."

Laysus sucks thoughtfully on his teeth.

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Lord Hoaracle lost his hand because of that."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "And you question why there are 

those amongst us who dislike people from your city stood at our nexus?"

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Perhaps, ultimately, it is that we 

have damned good reason."

Laysus shrugs helplessly.

You say, "The opposite. Such a history, and yet I stand here unquestioned and unchallenged in... 

whatever task I may have."

You say to Sarrasri, "I don't believe any have asked me why I'm standing here."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to you, "I've somewhat discerned it, 

so am unbothered."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to Sarrasri, "Do we care as to the 

why?"

You say, "Laysus Would you do anything about it?"

(TO LAYSUS. TO. LAYSUS. WHY MUST YOU BETRAY ME, FINGERS.)

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "By our laws, the sacred leaves,

I ask you to leave this forest if you have no work within it."

You say, "You ask. That's pleasant. Should I decline? What then? Would you assault me?"

Your compound eyes fixate on Laysus as your mandibles twitch to voice a brief, curious chirr.

( YOU WANNA FIGHT? But no this is to see if anyone is still rolling hard in the woods. It's important to Okpara,
but I also get how that could be a bit hostile. I thought since Sarrasri was vibing on what I was doing I'd be alright)

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Actually, no, I would defend my 

forest against one who would break its laws."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "With the aid of these lovely centaurs."

(The Centaur did that emote where it eyeballed him pretty hard)

You frown and say, "Your centaur does not appear to be your friend."

Laysus's eyes sparkle with amusement.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Arguably not, but he will do his job."

You frown and say to Sarrasri, "This is your Wood? Accepting and open of all within, politely 

requesting that those who serve no purpose and are of questionable alignment depart?"

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Requesting people trying to stir up trouble to leave."

You laughingly say, "The only trouble I bring is questioning of your ways."

You say, "If you cannot defend them..."

You shrug helplessly.

You say, "Perhaps this is not meant to be."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "You don't know our ways, 

evidently."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "The serenwilde is natural, savage, 

and unforgiving."

You say to Laysus, "I know what they used to be."

Laysus raises an eyebrow questioningly.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Evidently not."

You say to Laysus, "Not as old as you, or she, but older than many. I am familiar with how things 

once were in this wilde, and I hoped to find that again. If such is not the case, such is not the 

case."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "How things were a couple of 

centuries back are not how things were three centuries back, and not how they are now."

You say to Laysus, "I came here this day to see the Seren for what it was and to know that it was 

still the vanguard of nature that I knew it to be. I've been sleeping for some time and reached a 

point of reasoning I could not see beyond while remaining in my golden home."

You say, "So I have sought to poke at the heart of the Moonhart and see what stirs."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says to Sarrasri, "If you need to have the centaurs escort him out of 

the forest via death, I'll back you up that he was being a pain, abusing guest right and refusing to 

leave."

(Urdnot bails.)

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "Vanguard of nature, yes. But 

nature is not friendly. Nature is not forgiving. Nature is vicious and unfair and full of change."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "If that is what you want, then you 

could join us. If that is not what you want, then you should leave. Now."

Laysus shrugs helplessly.

(Woo! Daddy Laysus! That's exactly what I want)

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "It's of my belief that he's merely 

testing the mettle of those in the forest, before deciding whether to make the forest his home or 

not. Perhaps I am wrong, but I was curious to hear others respond to him."

You say, "I will be upfront. I am concerned that I've not yet been slain by refusing to leave and 

being a bit of a cad... but to me this means that either I need to learn more, or that things have 

slipped beyond my imagining while I have slept. It's my intent to join this place and become one 

with the more natural way of things."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to Sarrasri, "Are you playing with my 

hatred of citypeople again."

Laysus peers at Sarrasri unscrupulously.

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to Laysus, "Always."

The corners of Laysus's mouth turn up as he grins mischievously.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to Sarrasri, "You're a sweetheart, 

bringing me the best toys and games."

Laysus smirks.

Using your tongue and the roof of your mouth, you make a quiet clicking noise.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to you, "Have you ever been an enemy of 

the commune?"

You say to Laysus, "I have not."

Laysus sucks thoughtfully on his teeth.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Do you seek to join a guild within 

the Serenwilde, should you join?"

You say, "I would, if such was expected of me. These new guilds are strange and foreign."

Showing that he understands, Laysus nods his head slowly.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "I don't think it's required."

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says, "Are you an enemy of the Faethorn 

Realms, Mother Moon, Brother Stag or any of our villages?"

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "He is not."

You say, "I am enemy to the Krokani of the Moors, the Illithoid, the Gorgogs, Ladantine, and... ah...

all of Crumkindivia."

Sarrasri looks exhausted and opens her mouth in an enormous yawn.

You say, "...I enjoy the sweets."

Sarrasri gives a sugar crystal to you.

Chosen of Ellindel, Laysus L'Eternae of the Frozen Moon says to Sarrasri, "I gotta get leaving. Do 

you want to handle him reading the leaves?"

You suck thoughtfully upon a sugar crystal.

Sarrasri nods her head at Laysus.

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to you, "Follow me, please."

You begin to follow Sarrasri.

You bow respectfully to Laysus.

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says, "If you could read the leaves, please,

you will learn of our laws."

(LEAVES LAWS STUFF)

You say, "These laws are straightforward."

Moon Lake Rig-Wilde, Sarrasri Talnara, Arrow of the Hunt says to you, "Do any know of you in Celest? 

And if you can give me a precise reasoning to why you left, so I can explain to others."

Sarrasri nods her head emphatically.

You say, "I am sure some may know of me, somewhat, from my time in the Tahtetso. I could not name a 

name. To be frank, I am honest when I declare that I am nobody. I have simply awoken from a long 

slumber with a yearning of purpose in my heart."

You say, "If you seek to find some ill behavior or will in my past, you will not locate any."

You say, "If the Seren is so upset that I have questioned their complete open willingness to suffer 

my presence, then I personally believe things are even worse than my visions have led me to conclude."

You say, "One must question all things."

(I'm told at this point that somebody objects to my joining and I have to talk to Aramel. She's waiting at the portals. Away I go! Sarrasri bails at this point.)

Aramel tells you, "Greetings."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "Greetings."

Aramel tells you, "I hear that you wish to join the forest."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "That is indeed my desire, though, I suspect I have rankled a 

few of the 'wilde with my questions."

Aramel tells you, "To what purpose were the questions?"

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "To see whether or not I wished to make this place my home, or 

at least, get the measure of it before I made my final choice."

Aramel tells you, "I might be able to answer some of them."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "When I was young, the Seren were not as... I don't want to use 

an improper term. Friendly. They were not as friendly with my home as they appear to be now. It is a 

surprise to me that I was able to stand at the Moonhart without being questioned."

Aramel tells you, "Most would not find friendliness a thing to complain of."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "I suppose that I would be complaining, wouldn't I? I do not 

mean to. I wished to determine exactly how friendly things were. It may be a odd, but after such a 

lengthy period of my own meditations I have reached an inescapable conclusion regarding nature and 

the preservation thereof."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "It's just that what I once knew of the 'wilde may not be what 

the 'wilde is now."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "So I... poked at a few people. Questioned why they might allow 

me to remain standing there as I was. I wanted to see."

You say, "I've learned that some do not enjoy being questioned."

Aramel raises an eyebrow. "It is not usually considered courteous," she says, "To wander into 

someone's home and demand explanations of them."

You have emoted: Okpara bows low and remains there as he speaks. "True. I would find it further odd 

that one could barge into someone's home and not have an explanation demanded of them for doing so."

Rising, you say, "But I wonder if my manner of thinking is... dated, now."

After a moment, meditatively, Wildeflower Aramel Shevat says, "Some of us are not afraid of the 

outside world, nor of people who hail from there, as we once were. If you would turn friendliness 

into strife, it does not reflect well upon you."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "Perhaps, but I would sooner know the measure of my possible 

home and enter amid a small degree of noise, full of confidence, than slide quietly into the depths 

while remaining uncertain. It is my ardent desire to aid nature and learn all that I can to do so, 

and I am ignorant of so very much. I simply wished to make certain that those here were still 

possessed of the same vigorous spirit as I remember before I slept."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "Forgive me for speaking this way, but making words out loud 

hurts my face. Clickies? Jaw. It hurts my jaw."

Aramel tells you, "You will find, I think, that much has changed over the years."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "I am... discovering this."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "When I was last awake, I belonged to Lord Eventru's order. I am 

told that He is long departed from this world, if that gives any indication to how long I have slept."

Aramel tells you, "As there have been objections voiced in the commune, I'm forwarding the matter to 

the Seneschal."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "Interesting. Questions should not evoke such a polarized 

response. I've been waking for but a few days."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "If that is the way of it, so be it."

Aramel tells you, "The seneschal will speak with you at the Moonhart. A good day to you."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "To you as well."

(I wander around Serenwilde lost as hell for a minute before finding the Nexus and apologizing to Aeldra for being lost)

Aeldra Ladyn, Dancer Beneath Ancient Trees asks you, "I hear one of the things that came up here was 

that you were surprised that you were not thrown out of the forest?"

Rasping, you say, "I asked why I was not questioned or asked to explain my presence, then challenged 

those that eventually did so."

Urdnot shakes his head.

Pausing, you say, "I wanted to see."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "He asked why he wasn't questioned."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Then he asked why he wasn't questioned."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Then he asked why he wasn't questioned again."

You smile softly.

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Then after that he asked why he wasn't questioned."

Serenguard Urdnot Strongleaf says, "Until he finally stirred up a reaction."

Aeldra nods slowly.

Aeldra Ladyn, Dancer Beneath Ancient Trees asks you, "If we were to discard and question everyone 

who came here seeking to learn about our ways out of the forest... how would we ever convinced them 

that this, our way, is the best one?"

You tell Aeldra Ladyn, Dancer Beneath Ancient Trees, "True, but without questioning anyone who 

wanders in... how can it be said that you are the vanguards of this wood? I do not intend to 

disrespect, but this is more or less what I have asked."

You tell Aeldra Ladyn, Dancer Beneath Ancient Trees, "It is only that the Serenwilde is much more 

open than I have ever remembered."

Aeldra tells you, "Yes it is, but it's also not an isolated wood anymore that is hated by all of the 

basin for the way they act. We are an active part of an alliance against the corruption of the south.

And as our allies accept our presence within their halls ... we tolerate their presence within our 

forest. My hope is that every visitor takes a bit of what he sees here, back home."

Aeldra tells you, "Eventually those that visit come to stay. Well not all of them, but a good 

portion."

You tell Aeldra Ladyn, Dancer Beneath Ancient Trees, "Being hated for doing good is preferred to 

being liked for compromise of value, but I do understand what you are saying. There is a bit more 

honey to this situation than what I am used to. This basin is a far cry from the one I remember. It 

is very possible, very likely, that my perceptions are skewed in the past without regard to this new 

reality. I will consider this.

(There's this awesome Captain America quote that goes on about planting yourself like a tree beside
the river of truth and justice even when the world is yelling at you that you're wrong. I was rolling with that really hard)

Aeldra tells you, "Maybe it is advisable then that you do learn and see about this new reality. And 

maybe give a look as to how it feels to have the waves of enemies branding against our borders. 

You'll find that a good deal of our defense is not mounted by our people. It is getting more... but 

it's a long way to go. Being right doesn't really serve you much at all you stood for is burning and 

slowly consumed by fire and wyrd. I have to leave you for now, but I'll go and speak to those that 

object to your joining and we'll discuss it soon again. Maybe by that time, you'll have more insight 

yourself as to the path and how the world has changed since you last walked it?"

(Oh hey that's a pretty fair response. I mean you gotta get the help where you can get the help, right?
Still, Okpara's irritated at this point. WAS SO CLOSE to being inducted.)

You tell Aeldra Ladyn, Dancer Beneath Ancient Trees, "If that is your will, I shall do so. I will 

note a bit of irony that despite professing myself interested to learn of and protect nature that 

this has become such a peculiar ordeal because I have rustled a few feathers with my inquiries. 

Perhaps it is another sign of the times. Please rest well, Seneschal, and I wll walk about this 

basin for a bit longer."

(I go to bed, because what else am I gonna do? Quest? Seek out meaningful Roleplay? No! I've got a mission, and that mission is to pass out)

DAAAYYYYYYYY 2

(I log in and check Serenwilde. Aeldra's not CL anymore. Well. Alright, so much for that. Putzing about Tosha, then lingering at the Aetherplex for a while. Happen to run into Aramel. Perfect!)

You bow respectfully to Aramel.

Aramel greets you with a sincere smile.

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "Your Seneschal said that she would speak to some within the 

Serenwilde and get back to me, but... it looks like she is no longer Seneschal at all. I'm uncertain 

where that leaves my desire to join your home."

 

Aramel tells you, "I too am uncertain."

You tell Wildeflower Aramel Shevat, "I still desire to join, but, I do not understand. Is this the 

process that all must go through when seeking to join Serenwilde? Is this much discussion and 

contention normal?"

(Worded this odd, what I meant was wondering if joining Seren is usually this arduous and involved)

Aramel tells you, "I cannot comment."

Aramel inclines her head politely to those around her.

A cone of sparkling light rises up around Aramel and whisks her away.

(Oooookay. Well. Going to try and find someboy who actually can give me information. HELP SERENWILDE. Valaria can induct, let's bug her.)

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "Can I ask something of you?"

 

Valaria tells you, "Sure."

Valaria tells you, "What will be your question, Demigod?"

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "I am seeking to join the 

Serenwilde, but am given to understand that my entry has been contentious. I have spoken with 

Sarrasri, Aramel, and Aeldra about joining. Sarrasri was going to induct me, but again... there was 

contention. Your Seneschal spoke with me and said that she would consult some members of the 

Moonhart Circle, but seems to have abandoned her position."

Valaria tells you, "She abandoned her position with good reason. you could say there are some 

upravel about it."

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "Well... I've asked Aramel what 

my status is, and whether this degree of discussion and contention is normal, and have been told 

that she cannot comment. I do not know where I stand, or who I can even ask about it."

Valaria tells you, "May i ask you, why your entry has been contentious?"

Valaria tells you, "Do you have any history with related to serenwilde or anything else to it?"

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "Most likely because of the 

questions I asked and the implications I made at the Moonhart. I noted that it was odd that my 

presence was never questioned over the half day that I lingered and mused that Serenwilde was much 

different than when I was last awake. It was much more friendly that I have ever known it, and this 

observation... or perhaps how I said it? It was met with disgruntlement."

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "And no. I've no history 

outside of Celest, where I only served my Tahtetso to the best of my abilities."

Valaria tells you, "I see."

Valaria tells you, "For now Can I ask you wait and patient until serenwilde has chose their leader?"

Valaria tells you, "On second thought, i will ask Sarrasri about it when she is awake to see if 

there a solution to induction or something like that."

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "You wish me to not join your 

commune for another half year or more? I do not understand."

Valaria tells you, "Ah yes, look like one council is present, let me ask him."

Valaria tells you, "I cannot say about it anymore than that. it seem he refuse to discuss as council 

has more problem on their hand than it is. so there still some cloud to settles."

Valaria tells you, "Sadly, its out of my hand."

You tell Progenitor Valaria Strongleaf, Rig-Wilde of Alabaster Road, "So what can I do? What path is 

available to me?"

And that's it. No information after that. Was just left swinging.

So what's the deal? I could have sworn that the only rules for Serenwilde if I've never been enemied or aligned with an opposing org are to just have me read the laws and go through a simple induction process. That's what my friends both said when I brought this up. That's very much not what's taking place. I'm being given the run-around in a very real and obvious way. 

Is it because I had a bit of anti-city sentiment? Suggested that Serenwilde used to be a bit more xenophobic? It's literally the only opinion that I've been able to voice, even while saying that I might be wrong about how things are now and am willing to learn whatever the reality is. That's just what Seren was when I played Okpara last. That's what Seren was as far as Okpara knows, and he was miffed about that appearing to no longer be the case. ICly it already impacted his desire to join, but OOCly I still wanted him in there as a player. Should I just abandon the idea and go somewhere else?

Has anyone else had to go through some nonsense like this to join an Org, or is Seren just special?

Aren't waffles just like the most superior breakfast food or what? Down with pancakes.

Saz

You say, "Laysus A wilde that would question my presence within it, to start.

For reference, from your logs, Serenwilde seems to have done that and then decided to either reject/ask time to decide on your presence within. Not physically but as a member, obv. 

Regarding major RP-shifts. It's what happens when orgs die and reborn dramatically, losing their connections with the past-form with the majority of its people going inactive. So, it's natural. But yeah, you were pointed out legit reasons for delays too. Perhaps you should give it some time and ask others around or decide on what to do with this new Serenwilde you seemingly have come across rather shockingly.

Esoneyuna

First of all congrats on your RP commitment


Second, as I remember Serenwilde has always asked its members if they object to someone joining. If someone does it goes to the circle, it is just rare that potential recruits are adversarial the day they try to join. Now as you see they are having some form of trouble with their leadership and things like troublesome recruits and in my case unenemying takes a backseat to whatever those problems are.

While this is unfortunate the fact you were adversarial makes it entirely legitimate to ask you to be rogue for a while before being allowed to join. But honestly it seems you will be allowed in when they get things in order.

also Sarrasri

Okpara

I'm not following. Serenwilde seems to have done... what? That's what I'm getting at. It's weird, right, that some random nobody is looked into so hard about joining for no visible reason? Why was the leadership so involved in my coming in, in the first place?
  
I'm also familiar with dramatic RP shifts.

You're kind of not answering my more global question about whether this process I'm being subjected to is either unusual or not, and whether it's essentially worth my time to sit around waiting for a week or so if the answer is already kind of decided. Were it not for my OOC desire and the input of my friends, I would have probably taken the hint that I wasn't wanted already. 

So to reiterate: 

Is this a normal thing or am I just totes special?
Should I just go somewhere else?
Is the entirety of Seren leadership normally involved to this degree for every person trying to get in?
Has anyone else had to go through this in other orgs?
Pancakes or Waffles, take a stand.

Edit: First part of this was directed at Saz. That explanation from Esoneyuna at least sheds some kind of light on things, but I'm still told that this is a weird situation.
Double Edit: ....now that I think on it I really don't buy that you can't incitizen somebody because the CL just bailed. Is that a legit policy that they have? I seriously doubt everyone is so traumatized and completely disheveled that my admittance is just Too Big A Deal to handle. That's my Forum Complaint/Vent

Maligorn

I'm really confused. Do you want to be in Serenwilde or not? Are you trying to provoke them into thinking you're a threat...or not? Do you want them to be suspicious of you?

I just feel serious mixed signals.

Okpara

The Roleplay is not understanding why they weren't suspicious in the slightest, and questioning that seemingly new facet to the commune. It was apparent from the moment I got there, literally the first lines of roleplay, that I wanted to join.

Okpara just wanted to understand why things were happening in the way that they were.

Lehki

Did not read the entire log so sorry if I missed some context. About not being suspicious of outsiders. Yes Seren's more open to outsiders these days, probably because the current alliances have lasted literal years so there's some prominent players in Seren that have been allies with Celest the entire time they've played the game. Some older players still try to play up the xenophobia but it's hard to keep that up all the time when the general attitude's shifted away from that.

Esoneyuna

It is not so much that they do not have a seneschal as much as the reason they do not have one. And that was actually mentioned by the people you asked in game.

And I think we all get what you were RPing, but you must realize RP has consequences. Your character was after all being rather rude and critical of their ways. Also there are more things for them to deal with then just you.

Maligorn

Esoneyuna said:

It is not so much that they do not have a seneschal as much as the reason they do not have one. And that was actually mentioned by the people you asked in game.

And I think we all get what you were RPing, but you must realize RP has consequences. Your character was after all being rather rude and critical of their ways. Also there are more things for them to deal with then just you.

Pretty much this. And not only are you being critical of their trust of foreigners and their agreement to get you into Serenwilde, you're doing it in the weirdest way possible. You know, by offering their trust of yourself as a point of contention. =S

Okpara

I understand that RP has consequences, but I mean if asking a couple of questions is all it takes to get everyone in a tizzy I don't know what to say. That's really what it was at the end of the day.

You're letting me just stand here? Nobody knows who I am, is that a normal thing? It wasn't a normal thing back in the day. It's weird that that's a normal thing now. What would happen if I refused to leave? Would anyone do anything? Does anyone here fight? How friendly is this place now? This is all pretty new to me, how long has it been this way?

Laysus, the one I confronted in the most direct way possible, seemed pretty on board with the whole thing afterwards and Sarrasri knew the entire time what was going on. It wasn't like I was acting this out into a vacuum. 

Wobou

I don't get why this was brought before the circle at all. My understanding of our rules is that someone who has not been a member of the forest in the past can simply be joined if they have approval of a guild. That scroll was written when a guild meant something slightly different but not so different that we couldn't still follow it. Now granted the circle happens to be mostly the leaders of those guilds so maybe following that scroll would not have achieved a different result. From what I've read in the logs no one said "Sure but you need the approval of a guild leader". I imagine that being given a clear path to achieve your goals, even if that path fails, would be less frustrating than being given the run-around which appears to be what's happening in these logs (although I admit I haven't read all of it).

Saran

Yeah, I mean... maybe it was a bit awkward, but it seems like an attempt to find out of Serenwilde has the rp that they're looking for. Then after some people showed that we do there was an issue?

I wasn't around for any of this, so I only know what's shown in the log. 

Esoneyuna said:

Second, as I remember Serenwilde has always asked its members if they object to someone joining. If someone does it goes to the circle, it is just rare that potential recruits are adversarial the day they try to join. Now as you see they are having some form of trouble with their leadership and things like troublesome recruits and in my case unenemying takes a backseat to whatever those problems are.

According to CHELP WELCOMING you actually don't have a right to object any more it seems, possibly because of frivilous objections in the past that cause issues. 

Unless Okpara is a former seren or had an enemy status, there's nothing in the scroll to support the delay.

Anita

@Okpara, first off, I want to say I'm sorry for the way everything was handled! As you have pointed out, we are leaderless right now and in the process of starting elections for a new leader, and that in itself is creating a panic. You have to understand that losing a leader suddenly is pretty disheartening, and it causes a flailing of such in the daily running of the commune. It seems you were caught in the crossfire, and hopefully it will calm down soon and you will still consider joining Serenwilde.

Secondly, however, I don't want to come of as mean, but from your log it seems that it may have come off as rude by keep questioning those at the Moonhart why *they* weren't questioning you. By a simple honours of your character, you hold the title of Brother and graduated from the Celest collegium, enough for anyone to deduce that you're from New Celest - right? Right now, Serenwilde is in an alliance with New Celest and Hallifax, and this has been the case for a long while now. As someone mentioned above me, a lot of the people in Serenwilde have only known this alliance, it hasn't changed since they started playing, and so their views and such are more open to city-dwellers of the alliance entering the forest without being questioned, while some of the older characters still are straight wtf-mate-you-stinky-city-person. By keep questioning, you are certain to get a reaction and get a few backs up, of course you said you are nobody, but there you are demanding answers of someone's home...even after being told that things have clearly changed from when you were last awake. 

I'm not here to judge this any further, I just hope you understand that part, and that objections were raised because they were suspicious of your intent due to the questioning. You want to join... but you're questioning why they're not kicking you out? Doesn't make sense, at least to me. 

I'm still pretty unaware of this in-game other than brief mentions, I know the full details OOCly, so my advice would be to contact one of the guild leaders or one of the Ministers in HELP SERENWILDE, and explain your situation to one of them, perhaps ask to get them to bring it to the Moonhart Circle. It might take a little, but like I said at the beginning of my post, no leader = wtf do we do now panic. And might be unaware of the things the leader might have had plans for / ongoing situations.  Ideally, it shouldn't have even come to needing the Circle. A simple "this person is from Celest, never a Seren, never an enemy, woke from long slumber, in welcoming him" should have just been done as per our Welcoming scroll (mentioned somewhere above)

Reading some of the new posts since I started typing! Ok, so, no Serenwilde isn't suddenly "WHO ARE YOU WHY ARE YOU HERE LEAVE NOW OR DIE!" Anymore. As mentioned previously in this posting, by your honours it just seems like you're from New Celest, so.. pretty welcome. However, you may be asked to leave AT ANY TIME. I need to read the Leaves, I can't right now as I'm not logged in, but I'm pretty sure then it's you'll be escorted out not so nicely/killed/and enemied at refusal to do so. But from your log I do see that it was mentioned at least once, maybe twice that "things have changed since you last woke" (paraphrasing). 

(Also sorry if this is a long post!)

Thaendran

Saran said:

Yeah, I mean... maybe it was a bit awkward, but it seems like an attempt to find out of Serenwilde has the rp that they're looking for. Then after some people showed that we do there was an issue?

I wasn't around for any of this, so I only know what's shown in the log. 

Esoneyuna said:

Second, as I remember Serenwilde has always asked its members if they object to someone joining. If someone does it goes to the circle, it is just rare that potential recruits are adversarial the day they try to join. Now as you see they are having some form of trouble with their leadership and things like troublesome recruits and in my case unenemying takes a backseat to whatever those problems are.

According to CHELP WELCOMING you actually don't have a right to object any more it seems, possibly because of frivilous objections in the past that cause issues. 

Unless Okpara is a former seren or had an enemy status, there's nothing in the scroll to support the delay.

Doesn't change the fact he obviously bothered someone that has enough influence to bypass that scroll then, this person is (hopefully) also just RPing a bit. The root still lies with his chosen RP and a few rl days not being welcomed is nothing new and even not entirely unwarranted.

Arix

Could have been Laysus, he's pretty senior and from reading that post (also holy crap, Laysus was awake?) he might have objected on pure principle

Arix

And by senior I mean he's old

Lerad

Eh, I think it's cool to play up the xenophobic RP and all, but, like all other forms of org RP, it can be, and many times, is bypassed to varying degrees to ensure players have a smooth welcoming procedure. In fact, even if you were an enemy 5 RL years ago, it may even be possible to get fast-tracked into an unenemy-incitizen within minutes, depending on how much of a stickler the person handling the case is, and how big of a pain you made yourself in the past. Leaders in all orgs tend to do their best to make life easy for potential newcomers - and they're probably more understanding than usual currently, precisely because of the guild blowups. Pretty much anyone who has been in an old guild before (which is everybody) will be able to relate to the idea that things have changed enough for you to want to move orgs after your guild has been dismantled, literally (and then rebuilt, of course, but that's a digression).

All that said, if you want to pursue the org RP and all, then by all means - that's great and cool. But that does mean you don't get to have the fast-track treatment. If you want to challenge cultural norms and engage people on their RP, which is great, since we're (supposed to be) an RP-enforced mud, then you'll better buckle down for the ride, which may or may not include delays and days of waiting as a rogue, depending on what kind of RP you're engaging with.

I think it's very much weird to be displaying such a proper understanding of an org's RP, engaging with it at such depth... and then coming to the forums to complain about not being let in immediately?

Many people, even the hardcore RPers, are willing to close an eye on their own RP when it comes to making sure a player who wants to just have some fun can get into an org after a long break, or if a newish person comes asking entrance. Because we all know how inconvenient being not in an org can be - you're locked out of so much game content. But once you signal that you're not interested in being fast-tracked... then it's entirely possible you're making those players super happy - they can actually do what they claim their characters do, but which they rarely do because of wanting to make things fun for a potential fellow player, and that is to run you through the hoops.

If you didn't want to be run through the hoops... well, taking the fast-track treatment and then exploring your RP options after would have been the wiser choice, really.

Shaddus

I think you should  stand at the Megalith and demand to know why they haven't kicked you out put yet. 

Arix

You mean the hole in the ground where the Necropolis used to be?

Sarrasri

Fast tracked, or not fast tracked, this whole situation is getting ridiculous. Getting asked -questions- of all things, in which you may have to defend yourself, being the reason someone's not inducted right away is pushing it. Even in my most troublemaking days of the past, when Serenwilde -was- more xenophobic, never was it an option to make someone wait an extended period unless they were a high profile troublemaker, or just someone with a reputation of causing problems. Okpara is neither of these things. He asked some prodding questions, rankled a few people. I do that now by existing half the time.

What everyone needs to remember, is that RP questions or not, this is still a game. It's been made difficult enough already, and someone actually wants to join Serenwilde. I don't actually remember the last induction someone's had to do since I've started playing again. Maybe, just maybe, some should consider that their feelings and enjoyment are not the only things to be taken into consideration.

Gero

This is a joke, right?

Saran

Thaendran said:

Saran said:

Yeah, I mean... maybe it was a bit awkward, but it seems like an attempt to find out of Serenwilde has the rp that they're looking for. Then after some people showed that we do there was an issue?

I wasn't around for any of this, so I only know what's shown in the log. 

Esoneyuna said:

Second, as I remember Serenwilde has always asked its members if they object to someone joining. If someone does it goes to the circle, it is just rare that potential recruits are adversarial the day they try to join. Now as you see they are having some form of trouble with their leadership and things like troublesome recruits and in my case unenemying takes a backseat to whatever those problems are.

According to CHELP WELCOMING you actually don't have a right to object any more it seems, possibly because of frivilous objections in the past that cause issues. 

Unless Okpara is a former seren or had an enemy status, there's nothing in the scroll to support the delay.

Doesn't change the fact he obviously bothered someone that has enough influence to bypass that scroll then, this person is (hopefully) also just RPing a bit. The root still lies with his chosen RP and a few rl days not being welcomed is nothing new and even not entirely unwarranted.

Sure, except it seems like it's going to be a week of not being able to join because someone decided to swing their clout around and impose a rule which was removed in September because of stuff like this happening.

And there isn't necessarily any guarantee that they will be welcomed at the end of that.

We want people joining, the rule was removed so that we could get people into Serenwilde more easily.

Thaendran

Saran said:

Sure, except it seems like it's going to be a week of not being able to join because someone decided to swing their clout around and impose a rule which was removed in September because of stuff like this happening.

And there isn't necessarily any guarantee that they will be welcomed at the end of that.

We want people joining, the rule was removed so that we could get people into Serenwilde more easily.

Ok yeah obviously I misjudged the intent of the person objecting, I thought this was just a little fun way of RPing with him (and that during this time they would also continue to interact with him in a meaningful way) before letting him in. A week and possibly not being allowed to join is silly. The intent should have been to make that conflict fun not just punishment for the player and obviously they failed at that.

So my apologies Okpara, I judged you to quickly.

Kerith

Goodness... Well, I can't speak to the other orgs here, but in the org where I played in another IRE game, citizens did have the right to object to new members. In fact, it wasn't just asked on CT, it was asked on the news board. Citizens were then given a few RL days to tell the Ambassador anything - positive or negative - they had to say about the applicant, which the Ambassador would into account when making the decision. Frivolous objections would not be upheld, but legitimate ones would. Even if an applicant ended up getting approved, they still had to wait a few RL days. And everyone was okay with this.

Then again, that place had a much more mature and responsible player base. It was unusual for someone to have a sense of entitlement, speak rudely to or "poke" at their prospective city in a way that could reasonably be construed as hostile, object to an applicant frivolously, or require restrictive rules like not allowing anyone to object to an applicant for any reason. They took things on a case-by-case basis and could be trusted to use common sense, fairness, objectivity, and logic in rulings. People didn't tend to take things overly personally or instigate drama (when they tried, it was quickly squelched). To put it bluntly, it didn't feel like a babysitter was required every bleeding day.

But yeah, that was another game, another world... I don't know if any of the orgs in Lusternia are like that. Kind of curious now though.

Okpara

Ok. I'm going to shift this discussion a bit so bear with me.

I'm noting that a few of you have openly given my post the tl;dr treatment, which I get because it's a bit lengthy, which is obviously fine so long as you understand it sort of saps a bit of nuance from the individual interactions that I had during the log. You're missing out a bit on the things that actually puzzled Okpara (And me, leading to the post) and I feel should be puzzling for you as well. Plus you're missing out on my awesome commentary.

What convinced me to finally give Serenwilde a real go is that I am very familiar with the internal RP that's taking place through the aforementioned Seren IRL friends. You have this group of older characters who are still very much xenophobic and massively distrustful of the cities mixed in with this newer group of players/characters who've only ever known the good things that the cities have done for the forest. I would wager much of this is related to combat defenses and mutual success in revolts and domoths. It's basically necessary at this point to maintain those relationships and they realize this.

It's very much a clashing of generations where Serenwilde as a whole is starkly divided and attempting to truly discern where it stands. 

Is it just Youth vs Age?

Is it ok to give up a little in exchange for much more?

Is the old no longer working? 

Is the new giving up too much of the forest's history and ways? 

Where do you draw the line? 

Can Serenwilde be both, somehow?

What actions might lead to breaking an alliance, intentionally or uninentionally?

Are people overly fearful of this?

How does this shape internal and external interpersonal relationships?

I found that internal struggle for identity fascinating and I wanted in. Okpara was in that perfect situation to have seen how things once were, expect them to still be that way, and then be bewildered and a perhaps a bit angsty when they weren't. He'd steeled himself to move into this harsh forest and just... wasn't met with what he expected. It was almost a let down, but he also understood that things change. It felt like the perfect way to move into this internal conflict and sit at the middle of it all and have a character be influenced by conversations on both sides of the fence. That's the sort of thing that really gets me involved and moving in games like this. Excited! I mean, that's basically the *whole* of games like this, that contentious RP dynamic and contributing to the story taking place.

I guess I just didn't expect the nothing that I got. The run-around. Not that I was denied, not that I just had to wait, (Yes @Valaria did say that, but then also immediately changed her tune and said she couldn't talk about it after speaking to a Moonhart Circle member. It's very possible that she didn't see my last message, but I kind of got the impression that I was being ignored.) but that I had to wait for who knows how long for literally any information at all. Again, stressing that I've got no history with Seren within or against. If you're not going to let me in, then tell me that I'm not getting in. At least there's something that I can do or react to at that point. Try to change minds, become disgruntled and take a darker RP path, accept that offer to move into Hallifax, etc. The previous posts are exactly correct, I'm not overly thrilled at the idea of hanging around on this guy for a week or more waiting to get in and then just being told to shove off.

It's also weird that I keep getting told that this situation is very, very weird but that nobody (Who'll talk to me or give me information) seems to have the authority to do anything about it. That's my beef! My waffle.

Waffles > Pancakes. Fight me.

edit: Bolded and italicized some stuff

Kerith

The thing is, Serenwilde currently doesn't need more contention, promotion of conflict, or angst about change. [Edit: or divisive arguments about the old way vs the new way.] I wasn't there for any of this, nor have I heard any discussion besides this thread, so I could be wrong and I don't mean to speak for anyone else . . . but my feeling is that attitude makes a world of difference. The questions you just listed are totally legit and it's great that you're curious, but when I read the interaction - and yes I read the whole thing - that didn't translate. Okpara came across as trouble-seeking, conflict-seeking, and at a very bad time for that. He didn't really ask any of those questions, he just kept repeating "why aren't you kicking me out" over and over in a rather baiting tone. If he had asked those questions, in a more humble, open, and curious way, then I would expect a different response. Again, not trying to speak for anyone else and I apologize if I'm off-base.

Okpara

I disagree wholeheartedly about whether or not Serenwilde needs more discussion internally about a path forward, and I personally feel that this blockade is composed much more of people who disagree with the opinion voiced rather than the way it was voiced at the Moonhart. I've slowly reached the conclusion that your first few sentences have much more to do with my predicament than the latter few. I'm basing that on the IC and OOC discussions I've been so fortunate to be a part of. 

So while it's pleasant and reasonable to suggest what you are suggesting, and what you are saying indeed makes complete sense, I'm willing to bet money that's unfortunately not the case.

Eritheyl

Stopped reading at the point where you stood there, then asked why they were letting you stand there. I mean, if your intent is to come off as a complete annoyance, I can't say I'd have reacted any differently than they did.

Edit: Okay I skipped to the bottom and read some more, you're just a snob. Sorry, not Serenwilde's fault.

Kerith

If you're asking "what's the dealio" and we're telling you what it is and you respond with "I don't believe you"... then it's really hard for us to believe you have any motive, IC or OOC, other than stirring up strife. You've gotten explanations, take them or leave them.

Okpara

I suppose that's fair. 

I'll take into account who's giving those explanations as well.

Sorry to bother folks

Eritheyl said:

Stopped reading at the point where you stood there, then asked why they were letting you stand there. I mean, if your intent is to come off as a complete annoyance, I can't say I'd have reacted any differently than they did.

Edit: Okay I skipped to the bottom and read some more, you're just a snob. Sorry, not Serenwilde's fault.

Eritheyl