That's all you get. That's all a runist/DW mage gets. That's all a researcher gets. And so on and so forth. Psi blade is actually the exception to the rule.
Does dreamweaving burst no longer exist?
If there's a dreambody at your location and you go to sleep to try and burst them.... well, let's just say you're dead. They'll drain your mana (Ego with the current changes) and get a free eternalsleep on you. Kether/Violet or don't bother.
Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heel that has crushed it.
It still exists, though. Wait, was the inquiry from a mechanic point of view or an rp point of view?
Definitely RP. That Necromancers have no way to see, hear or attack out-of-phase things like ghostforms or dreambodies, even when is ghostform themselves, is.. bizzare?
Nekotai seems to have such cool people, I'm tempted to jump. But, I'm not gonna let people down by abandoning Ninja.
Not without favoring Shaddus to GR3, you won't. Hint. Hint.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
It still exists, though. Wait, was the inquiry from a mechanic point of view or an rp point of view?
Definitely RP. That Necromancers have no way to see, hear or attack out-of-phase things like ghostforms or dreambodies, even when is ghostform themselves, is.. bizzare?
Not really. Just because you can become a thing, doesn't really mean that you need a way to do all kinds of things to that thing. Necromancy is mostly about control over the physical corpse / body, not the spirit (and even in becoming a ghost, you're basically just severing the connection to your body).
It's kind of like saying Stag users can take on Stag form, so they should be able to murder stags much more easily and have abilities designed around murdering stags. One does not actually lead to the other.
In addition, there are way, way more "out of phase" things that have nothing to do with death or undead things at all... like, pretty much every other use of out of phase. It would make zero sense for necromancy to be able to manipulate these things.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Xenthos said: Necromancy is mostly about control over the physical corpse / body, not the spirit.
Nnnope. Necromancy is about life energy. Body's just the most typical interface for it. Look at cannibalize, leech, drain, contagion, raisedead. Rest of the comment is pretty much valid if you discount the number of entirely incorporeal undead out there that a necromancer should probably be trained to handle.
Not really. Just because you can become a thing, doesn't really mean that you need a way to do all kinds of things to that thing.
Seeing and attacking is the set of basic things you'd expect someone who can work with phases to able to do. That's not asking for everything, that's wondering why we don't have that basic competence.
Necromancy is mostly about control over the physical corpse / body, not the spirit (and even in becoming a ghost, you're basically just severing the connection to your body).
Mostly being the key part here. Necromancy blurs the line, having curses like leech or omen and physical attacks like sacrifice side by side. Ectoplasm could go either way.
It's kind of like saying Stag users can take on Stag form, so they should be able to murder stags much more easily and have abilities designed around murdering stags. One does not actually lead to the other.
In addition, there are way, way more "out of phase" things that have nothing to do with death or undead things at all... like, pretty much every other use of out of phase. It would make zero sense for necromancy to be able to manipulate these things.
Yet the other abilities that target things out of phase are quite indiscriminate (only one I'm not sure of is that glamours ability). For this to make any sense these things would have to have no effect on ghost forms.
Why don't Serenwilde and Celest have methods for influencing the undead? Serenwilde guilds literally summon up ancestral spirits and so on, Celest can easily make the case for redeeming the undead through proselytization. Different meaning of the word 'spirit', there are your apples to oranges.
Glamours does not have any ability that targets out of phase people. It's worth noting that a necromancy ghost is not just a 'spirit', it's also the dispersed body of the necromancer - like the ol' gaseous form d&d spell - that later recoalesces. I wouldn't therefore call Necromancers people who can 'work with phases', certainly not beyond the power of dreamweavers.
The only other two functional phasing abilities are dreambody where the will of the dreamweaver steps away from their body (NOT a ghostly spirit) and glamours statue/nature, where presumably the illusion is so convincing they are displaced from the plane slightly by it. All of the attacks against out-of-phase people are in some way are efforts of will, not evidence of mastery over ghosts.
That said, who cares? The only time it's really useful to have kether on hand en masse is to kill necromancers who ghost. Were I a Necromancer, I'd not want to add more random minor effects to my bag of tricks, and would focus more on making my class work, heh.
I thought Serenwilde's argument was 'They're dead spirits, not undead ghosts.' At least, that's what every Spiritsinger I've spoken to claims.
The general rule is, you need kether or violet to hurt out-of-phase stuff. I highly suspect the reason psionics has an ability that is an exception to the rule, is because of Psylocke from the X-Men, who likes stabbing spirits/astralforms in the head with her 'psiblade'.
EDIT: Actually, doesn't Illuminati have a thing that does that too? Perhaps all the guardian guilds need that, just because they're the 'priest' class.
That was kind of my point there, heh. Not all 'spirits' are ghosts. Just because the dreamweaver is an 'incorporeal spirit' does not mean a Necromancer can do squat to them by virtue of having power over 'ghosts'.
Harmony monks can also attack out of phase people, but it's on par with psiblade, which is weaker than kether/violet.
Hey, I'm working on my enemy status, now all that's left is Glom itself. Also, will be trans aethercraft soonish, so...drop me a tell and I'll join you.
I thought Serenwilde's argument was 'They're dead spirits, not undead ghosts.' At least, that's what every Spiritsinger I've spoken to claims.
I assume ancestral spirits are literal incarnations of ancestral worship- worship which, in the real world, does assume that those spirits are real and have an active, physical presence in the world, even if no one necessarily sees them or their influence. The only difference between that and Lusternia is that we can see them and verify the effects they have. I can easily grasp that there's a difference between an ancestral spirit and an undead spirit that has been forcefully or unnaturally been brought back to un-life.
Basically, ancestral spirits would exist regardless of any force capable of creating undead, and are in that sense a natural part of the world(as they would be in the real world, too), a result of what happens after one dies if one has a strong enough connection to family/clan. Just because they and 'undead ghosts' both could be called 'spirits' doesn't mean there's any connection, mechanically or uh, spiritually. I mean... the Holy Spirit isn't undead either, so... yeah, different meanings for the same word.
"Chairwoman," Princess Setisoki states, holding up a hand in a gesture for her to stop and returning the cup. "That would be quite inappropriate. One of the males will serve me."
The Holy Spirit is not something that was once a mortal, and then died.
Ancestral spirits are. But...must write in game books on this.
The word is still the same, even if the meaning varies with context. Ancestral spirits are a natural force. The word undead almost always implies something unnatural.
"Chairwoman," Princess Setisoki states, holding up a hand in a gesture for her to stop and returning the cup. "That would be quite inappropriate. One of the males will serve me."
I'm not sure what sort of spirit Kethaera knows that's holy, but it's probably just a lich.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
I'm not sure what sort of spirit Kethaera knows that's holy, but it's probably just a lich.
There's also the Supernals, you troll :P
"Chairwoman," Princess Setisoki states, holding up a hand in a gesture for her to stop and returning the cup. "That would be quite inappropriate. One of the males will serve me."
Wanting to do the Serenwilde Epic. Every single time I have time. Someone else gets to do it, I have to wait because they were there first. They made a project so people can get a chance.. It's been over 2 RL months.
Currently Playing in: The doctors office. One more needle and I might just lose it again.
Comments
Forgiveness is the fragrance that the violet sheds on the heel that has crushed it.
The Inner Sea. I take commissions doe.
It's kind of like saying Stag users can take on Stag form, so they should be able to murder stags much more easily and have abilities designed around murdering stags. One does not actually lead to the other.
In addition, there are way, way more "out of phase" things that have nothing to do with death or undead things at all... like, pretty much every other use of out of phase. It would make zero sense for necromancy to be able to manipulate these things.
Mostly being the key part here. Necromancy blurs the line, having curses like leech or omen and physical attacks like sacrifice side by side. Ectoplasm could go either way.
That's nonconstructive apples and oranges talk.
Yet the other abilities that target things out of phase are quite indiscriminate (only one I'm not sure of is that glamours ability). For this to make any sense these things would have to have no effect on ghost forms.
That said, who cares? The only time it's really useful to have kether on hand en masse is to kill necromancers who ghost. Were I a Necromancer, I'd not want to add more random minor effects to my bag of tricks, and would focus more on making my class work, heh.
The general rule is, you need kether or violet to hurt out-of-phase stuff. I highly suspect the reason psionics has an ability that is an exception to the rule, is because of Psylocke from the X-Men, who likes stabbing spirits/astralforms in the head with her 'psiblade'.
EDIT: Actually, doesn't Illuminati have a thing that does that too? Perhaps all the guardian guilds need that, just because they're the 'priest' class.
Go go stealth guild teamup.
Ancestral spirits are. But...must write in game books on this.
Er yeah, we have cool people! >_>
I'm not sorry.
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The Inner Sea. I take commissions doe.
Currently Playing in: The doctors office. One more needle and I might just lose it again.