Not trying to derail further but I feel as though you are missing the point. Estarra literally said "Shame on you." and removing parts of someone's post or whole posts as you have done on this thread and others is a method of silencing someone. You complained about lack of context, I gave it. Someone else gave it too and you silenced them! You complain that I am using something out of context, other players showed you how it isn't, you still make subtle attempts at gaslighting me into thinking I am complaining about something that isn't something others are also complaining about because the subject of my book makes you squick where as others are easily handled by your precious sensibilities. Fine, ban players from writing about rape if it is too much for you to handle. Make it a damn rule and be done with it.
The whole point of this thread is MAKE A DAMN RULE and stick to it. And I volunteered my book and my situation as something to go off of because most people are too scared to upset Estarra and don't even know how to start a conversation that is upsetting. I'm not afraid. I don't care if your feelings get hurt, that is why people hate me. I will say what is what and give no damns. You are in the wrong. Do the right damn thing.
I apologize, I explained in the post just above yours. I'm sorry, I missed that.
I only removed statements that were false and inaccurate after asking you to stop posting them. I actually left the initial ones there. You don't get to make false and accusatory statements with impunity. You don't get to pretend you're speaking the truth and saying 'what is what' while insulting and accusing wrongly. We stand up for ourselves and get accused of bullying, harassment and gaslighting. Unbelievable.
You did give the context, which validated that your previous statement was out of context. Maybe you didn't realize it? It wasn't in regards to lore or cannon, but instead in regards to what's appropriate to publish within Lusternia, in which the administration has the final say. I explained that we need that level of autonomy for the unexpected and will strive to be more transparent about it in the future. Is that not enough for you?
What is the right damn thing? You mean stick with the rule we've already made and already stuck with? Acknowledge we can be better and more transparent?
You apologised for upsetting someone else because they called you out. I have never ever received anything but hassle form anyone on the admin team about this book. The context was really simple. I had a book removed and the end result as it stands is that you can removed anything you want without any reason. It matched the same problems scholarly books were facing. That was the context. I didn't care about my book, all I was trying to do was say "Hey guys this is why, they have this rule which nullifies any other rule." and none of you liked me pointing that out.
So the right thing to do would be to listen to what the players are asking from you to help build a better library system, as for me. Ask your wife how she would feel if she were me and get back to me.
Edit: or your mother, sister, daughter, hell any man that has a story to tell that was hard to live through, write, share publicly.
I have such a story... I wouldn't share that story or anything like that story publically. In fact, the only time I've shared that story was, I just checked, approximately 47 times to completion in front of a therapist during exposure therapy. I understand the feeling of sharing such a story and having it revoked. It's not a fun feeling to imagine.
But the problem with making this an issue of your book and your own trauma, is that the onus then becomes about you and your story, and the personal offense that can be taken from it. Rather than this...
Should admins be allowed to revoke works that have been passed by another staff member?
My opinion on this question is yes, if there is consensus. Admins are the authority on what is right and wrong, and if they agree on a matter it shouldn't be a case of players arguing with them. You can complain about it all you want. But in this case. Revoking a book with explicit mentions or details of rape, makes for a more positive and less hostile environment.
And to be clear. You can have your story... You can share your story. No one is saying you cannot. However, you have to judge the potential harm that can occur. And as a staff, their obligation is to mediate and mitigate what harm can come.
From my point of view, the scholarly books were being rejected by the stated rules on HELP CRITIQUING. For instance, Curwa's book was rejected due to it being speculative and not saying so which is stated in the standards and guidelines for HELP CRITIQUING. I understand that this rejection is contested, but again, it wasn't just because someone didn't like it (they actually did enjoy the book).
Your book was rejected due to its content and appropriateness within Lusternia. That's the distinct difference and why I feel the statement from Estarra regarding admin oversight is out of context in regards to everything else. Do you agree that we need a level of autonomy for when something else pops up?
At this point, both Estarra and myself have acknowledged that we can be more transparent and clear. We can try to work out more distinct rules but that takes time and effort which delays other things. It's not going to happen tomorrow, or even a month from now but we can certainly try to address it in the future.
From my point of view, the scholarly books were being rejected by the stated rules on HELP CRITIQUING. For instance, Curwa's book was rejected due to it being speculative and not saying so which is stated in the standards and guidelines for HELP CRITIQUING. I understand that this rejection is contested, but again, it wasn't just because someone didn't like it (they actually did enjoy the book).
I'm going to poke at this more because I really, really don't understand this. Seriously, this is straight from the book. Emphasis mine.
"It should be emphasized, however, that these theoretical interpretations are not in any way proven - these essay serves more as a pre-registration of my hypothesis in the proudest traditions of the scientific method, so that none can say after the fact that I fitted my hypothesis to the experimental results rather than using the results to validate or disconfirm my prior suppositions. While I would go so far to assert that they seem plausible and consistent with the current research in the fields of High Magic and Tarot, I shall not claim them as Truth until I have seen the evidence myself. (Take nobody's word for it!)"
What more could you want on that? Do you need a fancy ASCII front piece on page 1 that says "This book is speculation!" or something? It says it is not proven and is not claiming them as truth!
Edit because I'm annoyed enough to be grotesquely blunt: That is an entire paragraph dedicated to explaining it is speculation.
Any sufficiently advanced pun is indistinguishable from comedy.
Not trying to derail further but I feel as though you are missing the point. Estarra literally said "Shame on you." and removing parts of someone's post or whole posts as you have done on this thread and others is a method of silencing someone. You complained about lack of context, I gave it. Someone else gave it too and you silenced them! You complain that I am using something out of context, other players showed you how it isn't, you still make subtle attempts at gaslighting me into thinking I am complaining about something that isn't something others are also complaining about because the subject of my book makes you squick where as others are easily handled by your precious sensibilities. Fine, ban players from writing about rape if it is too much for you to handle. Make it a damn rule and be done with it.
The whole point of this thread is MAKE A DAMN RULE and stick to it. And I volunteered my book and my situation as something to go off of because most people are too scared to upset Estarra and don't even know how to start a conversation that is upsetting. I'm not afraid. I don't care if your feelings get hurt, that is why people hate me. I will say what is what and give no damns. You are in the wrong. Do the right damn thing.
I apologize, I explained in the post just above yours. I'm sorry, I missed that.
I only removed statements that were false and inaccurate after asking you to stop posting them. I actually left the initial ones there. You don't get to make false and accusatory statements with impunity. You don't get to pretend you're speaking the truth and saying 'what is what' while insulting and accusing wrongly. We stand up for ourselves and get accused of bullying, harassment and gaslighting. Unbelievable.
You did give the context, which validated that your previous statement was out of context. Maybe you didn't realize it? It wasn't in regards to lore or cannon, but instead in regards to what's appropriate to publish within Lusternia, in which the administration has the final say. I explained that we need that level of autonomy for the unexpected and will strive to be more transparent about it in the future. Is that not enough for you?
What is the right damn thing? You mean stick with the rule we've already made and already stuck with? Acknowledge we can be better and more transparent?
You apologised for upsetting someone else because they called you out. I have never ever received anything but hassle form anyone on the admin team about this book. The context was really simple. I had a book removed and the end result as it stands is that you can removed anything you want without any reason. It matched the same problems scholarly books were facing. That was the context. I didn't care about my book, all I was trying to do was say "Hey guys this is why, they have this rule which nullifies any other rule." and none of you liked me pointing that out.
So the right thing to do would be to listen to what the players are asking from you to help build a better library system, as for me. Ask your wife how she would feel if she were me and get back to me.
Edit: or your mother, sister, daughter, hell any man that has a story to tell that was hard to live through, write, share publicly.
I have such a story... I wouldn't share that story or anything like that story publically. In fact, the only time I've shared that story was, I just checked, approximately 47 times to completion in front of a therapist during exposure therapy. I understand the feeling of sharing such a story and having it revoked. It's not a fun feeling to imagine.
But the problem with making this an issue of your book and your own trauma, is that the onus then becomes about you and your story, and the personal offense that can be taken from it. Rather than this...
Should admins be allowed to revoke works that have been passed by another staff member?
My opinion on this question is yes, if there is consensus. Admins are the authority on what is right and wrong, and if they agree on a matter it shouldn't be a case of players arguing with them. You can complain about it all you want. But in this case. Revoking a book with explicit mentions or details of rape, makes for a more positive and less hostile environment.
And to be clear. You can have your story... You can share your story. No one is saying you cannot. However, you have to judge the potential harm that can occur. And as a staff, their obligation is to mediate and mitigate what harm can come.
Again. It isn't about the story, it is about the reasons that were given and the way it was handled. It could have been about cats lapping for for all I care. If you revoke a reason for something being banned and continue to ban it 'just because' that is wrong.
And no, not all people are capable of sharing their stories, this isn't 'my' story it is a representation of one aspect of my experiences alive on this earth manifested for a Serenwilde character that was potentially something I was going to work in to using IG if I felt i could. But I have never gotten around to develop Ena because I have been stuck in this position of being told rape doesn't exist, only in lore...which obviously makes no bloody sense. There are loads of examples of people using their real life experiences to develop character histories and general RP plots. This is about two aspects. My personal one which I did not make this about until they declared I was using something out of context, and how they critque books for the library system. They aren't the same problem, and they don't need to be resolved the same way.
Another reason I fight this is because heaven forbid you did decide one day want to explore what it would be like to express yourself through Lusternia to deal with something traumatic...how the hell would you feel being treated this way? So maybe if i can call the BS here and make them see what they are doing is wrong, you or someone else won't ever have to go through this crap either. But whatever, apparently I just love rape and make it all up for funsies.
Edit: I was going to make the same point as Portius but he made it. People should speak up on behalf of this book Portius is discussing, because it should be on the shelf! It is okay to be human and make errors. Admin, we know you aren't robots. We just want you to say sorry and work with us. The reason I am being so vocal about all of this is to help people to speak up and see that it is okay to tell admin no you are wrong. Of course I am more aggressive than anyone else. It is how I roll. But you can all speak up in your own ways. It's okay.
This entire thread has gone from a civil dispute to just a full-on fight and isn't really conducive to getting things done. Points have been made on both sides, and those points HAVE BEEN noted by both sides. Take a break from this and let's refocus.
Again. It isn't about the story, it is about the reasons that were given and the way it was handled. It could have been about cats lapping for for all I care. If you revoke a reason for something being banned and continue to ban it 'just because' that is wrong.
The problem here is that simply bringing up your book makes the onus be upon you. And your events, where as my post stated, a staffs job is to consider the whole over the individual. Much as this sucks to have to say so explicitly.
And no, not all people are capable of sharing their stories, this isn't 'my' story it is a representation of one aspect of my experiences alive on this earth manifested for a Serenwilde character that was potentially something I was going to work in to using IG if I felt i could. But I have never gotten around to develop Ena because I have been stuck in this position of being told rape doesn't exist, only in lore...which obviously makes no bloody sense. There are loads of examples of people using their real life experiences to develop character histories and general RP plots. This is about two aspects. My personal one which I did not make this about until they declared I was using something out of context, and how they critque books for the library system. They aren't the same problem, and they don't need to be resolved the same way.
You don't matter. Your story doesn't matter. Your choices for RP don't matter. In the eyes of a staff member, what matters instead is the amount of harm that may come from your story. The choices you may make in furthering your RP that may impact the game for everyone. And the ideation and events that could occur by allowing these things
Another reason I fight this is because heaven forbid you did decide one day want to explore what it would be like to express yourself through Lusternia to deal with something traumatic...how the hell would you feel being treated this way? So maybe if i can call the BS here and make them see what they are doing is wrong, you or someone else won't ever have to go through this crap either. But whatever, apparently I just love rape and make it all up for funsies.
No where did I imply you were making it up. The difference between the argument you are making, and the narrative you are attempting to purport. Is the publicity of it.
Context matters in this case. You may be safe and free in your experimentation and exploration of that aspect of yourself. But are others? A 16 year old me with a fresh wound running down their arm and a chip on their shoulder about 10000 times larger than mine today would have probably been massively triggered. By any mention of rape.
There's a time, a context and more importantly a place. I do not ask my dom to walk me down the street in full kit. Because I am sensitive to the eyes of those others I may traumatize. This is what I was attempting to point out earlier. YOUR catharsis is all well and good, however, does that catharsis effect OTHERS in a potentially negative manner. This is a good reason to have a blanket rule allowing staff to pull what they find objectionable, if there is a some form of consensus amongst the staff.
Edit: I was going to make the same point as Portius but he made it. People should speak up on behalf of this book Portius is discussing, because it should be on the shelf! It is okay to be human and make errors. Admin, we know you aren't robots. We just want you to say sorry and work with us. The reason I am being so vocal about all of this is to help people to speak up and see that it is okay to tell admin no you are wrong. Of course I am more aggressive than anyone else. It is how I roll. But you can all speak up in your own ways. It's okay.
Hence why I am here engaging you. Portius' point is adjacent to your issue. And utterly unrelated to your case. Inconsistency in grading what should be scholarly works is a massive issue to consider. I agree with him, in his case, that work did everything right and was removed.
To avoid this getting ANY FURTHER OFF TRACK...forget specific examples. Purpose of the thread is not to rehash what was in the past, but to move forward for better in the future.
Can the library system of regulation for submissions be made more transparent, i.e. a definitive reason stated for why something is rejected, for the sake of current and future submissions being better honed by experienced librarians towards something fitting the standards expected for the game?
And might we consider creating a system of different categories for the library...fiction, nonfiction, opinions (for those that seem a blend of the two, needing RP to work out as factual or not, so great for scientific endeavors being published and worked on via RP engagement)?
From my point of view, the scholarly books were being rejected by the stated rules on HELP CRITIQUING. For instance, Curwa's book was rejected due to it being speculative and not saying so which is stated in the standards and guidelines for HELP CRITIQUING. I understand that this rejection is contested, but again, it wasn't just because someone didn't like it (they actually did enjoy the book).
I'm going to poke at this more because I really, really don't understand this. Seriously, this is straight from the book. Emphasis mine.
"It should be emphasized, however, that these theoretical interpretations are not in any way proven - these essay serves more as a pre-registration of my hypothesis in the proudest traditions of the scientific method, so that none can say after the fact that I fitted my hypothesis to the experimental results rather than using the results to validate or disconfirm my prior suppositions. While I would go so far to assert that they seem plausible and consistent with the current research in the fields of High Magic and Tarot, I shall not claim them as Truth until I have seen the evidence myself. (Take nobody's word for it!)"
What more could you want on that? Do you need a fancy ASCII front piece on page 1 that says "This book is speculation!" or something? It says it is not proven and is not claiming them as truth!
Edit because I'm annoyed enough to be grotesquely blunt: That is an entire paragraph dedicated to explaining it is speculation.
I don't have a good response to this. That's why I acknowledged the contestation (and haven't addressed it other than that). From my point of view, without actually consulting the admin who initially did the rejection, it just looks like this was missed or glossed over. The only point I was trying to make there was that the rejection wasn't arbitrary 'we don't like it and so we're rejecting it' that's been implied but instead a 'we actually like it but it doesn't fit the rules laid out.'
That's the point that seems to be continuously made, that we'll just reject a book because we feel like it and that's just simply not true.
Of all the books you could bring up to dispute the library system, you've chosen the one most likely to halt all positive conversation and direction. 10/10, would watch people shoot themselves in the foot again.
All this did was bring to light how aggressively admin will stick to "We are right you are wrong." when a rejection is appealed. And some people jumped on the 'let's hate Ena' bandwagon because let's face it, that is what most of you are gonna do.
No one would have had this discussion if I hadn't of shared what I did. Because no one else has ever been told "We are gonna ban things because we have the right to, too bad." so if I had to put up with your bullying and nonsense all over discord and what not it was well worth it. Because books like the one Portius is discussing can now hopefully be shelved.
Only one person is sticking to the 'I am right, you are wrong' mantra and that's Enadonella.
Lets look at a sequence of posts.
From Devora (the bold is Enadonella bolding it for the next comment)
2) yes, there are people who can do it thoughtfully, but letting anyone talk about sexual violence in library works would likely get exploited in problematic ways that are hard to regulate. Best not to leave the door open for that kind of abuse.
Followed up by Enadonella
I have always maintained that if that were the reason given, I'd have been fine and accepted that because it is valid.
And two quotes she posted from the admin prior to that statement.
We are not marginalising sexual violence; we are deeming it to not be something we wish to include in our gameworld. Thank you.
Regarding appeal of the book regarding rape, we reserve the right to reject any submission for any reason. In this case, we felt your story was too explicit for Lusternia. There are no hard or fast guidelines except that we hope writers intending to distribute writing in Lusternia's public library system will refrain for sexual explicit or potentially triggering subject matter. Again, what constitutes that will be decided on a case-by-case basis in our sole and absolute discretion.
Apparently, that's a valid reason by your own reasoning, yet you still argued and continued your crusade, issuing and emailing.
So yes, continue your glorious campaign to right the wrongs of the library. To fight against the 'valid' reasoning you, yourself agreed with and 'always maintained'
The other thing that seems to be not mentioned here is that if a book is rejected for whatever reason, it can be editted and re-submitted to fix the issues.
Sorry, I missed this and it was recently pointed out to me. I am not sure how many times I asked for it to be pointed out where exactly I was explicitly sexual or where sexual violence was depicted so that I might have a chance at amending the offensive parts of the book. And again and again it was ignored. So, please. If someone can. I'd love some feedback on the book. Tell me what is too explicit.
https://ada-young.appspot.com/pastebin/sgOO3bqD
Cheers!
Only one person is sticking to the 'I am right, you are wrong' mantra and that's Enadonella.
Lets look at a sequence of posts.
From Devora (the bold is Enadonella bolding it for the next comment)
2) yes, there are people who can do it thoughtfully, but letting anyone talk about sexual violence in library works would likely get exploited in problematic ways that are hard to regulate. Best not to leave the door open for that kind of abuse.
Followed up by Enadonella
I have always maintained that if that were the reason given, I'd have been fine and accepted that because it is valid.
And two quotes she posted from the admin prior to that statement.
We are not marginalising sexual violence; we are deeming it to not be something we wish to include in our gameworld. Thank you.
Regarding appeal of the book regarding rape, we reserve the right to reject any submission for any reason. In this case, we felt your story was too explicit for Lusternia. There are no hard or fast guidelines except that we hope writers intending to distribute writing in Lusternia's public library system will refrain for sexual explicit or potentially triggering subject matter. Again, what constitutes that will be decided on a case-by-case basis in our sole and absolute discretion.
Apparently, that's a valid reason by your own reasoning, yet you still argued and continued your crusade, issuing and emailing.
So yes, continue your glorious campaign to right the wrongs of the library. To fight against the 'valid' reasoning you, yourself agreed with and 'always maintained'
Actually it was pointed out by multiple players throughout the thread. And is discussed on Lusternia discord by players. So...I'm not the only one who sees it.
I don't even know who you are, I don't talk to you, play with you, nothing. If you are speaking on behalf of someone else, you should probably get all the facts first. Cheers.
@Shango, I know you have a personal problem with Enadonella, but if your response to seeing somebody vent because they're clearly hurting is to start Spam-flagging their posts, then you need to take a good hard look at yourself. @Ellowyn's 'contribution' is similarly sickening. This kind of disgusting behaviour is what turned this so-called community (as a whole - pockets of it are fantastic, it's when all the pockets meet that we get... this) into the mire it is, and to be totally frank I'm a little confused as to why nobody's being pulled up on it. Seems you've both a got wakabi in this race that has nothing to do with the book or the library. And while we're getting our Longpaw on, a credit gives you 3000 that one of you started that petition.
"LADIES AND GENTLEMEN! MAESTRA HAS LOST THE RACE!"
Look, maybe I'm just naively hoping for an end to this discussion, but my question was innocent enough. It's not my fault if you guys take offence to it (especially if there's nothing to take offence for).
We have held off doing so as long as possible to allow everyone to make their cases, but unfortunately We feel We must now close this thread.
We are not going to issue any warnings or similar for anything said here, but We will note that what is causing Us to close it is the devolution of the debate into nothing but personal attacks.
Thank you to everyone who has made a case here, who has made suggestions and pointed out flaws. The Havens team have been watching throughout and discussing what can be done moving forward; the closure of this thread will not change that.
Comments
But the problem with making this an issue of your book and your own trauma, is that the onus then becomes about you and your story, and the personal offense that can be taken from it. Rather than this...
Should admins be allowed to revoke works that have been passed by another staff member?
My opinion on this question is yes, if there is consensus. Admins are the authority on what is right and wrong, and if they agree on a matter it shouldn't be a case of players arguing with them. You can complain about it all you want. But in this case. Revoking a book with explicit mentions or details of rape, makes for a more positive and less hostile environment.
And to be clear. You can have your story... You can share your story. No one is saying you cannot. However, you have to judge the potential harm that can occur. And as a staff, their obligation is to mediate and mitigate what harm can come.
As far as context, we can agree to disagree then,
From my point of view, the scholarly books were being rejected by the stated rules on HELP CRITIQUING. For instance, Curwa's book was rejected due to it being speculative and not saying so which is stated in the standards and guidelines for HELP CRITIQUING. I understand that this rejection is contested, but again, it wasn't just because someone didn't like it (they actually did enjoy the book).
Your book was rejected due to its content and appropriateness within Lusternia. That's the distinct difference and why I feel the statement from Estarra regarding admin oversight is out of context in regards to everything else. Do you agree that we need a level of autonomy for when something else pops up?
At this point, both Estarra and myself have acknowledged that we can be more transparent and clear. We can try to work out more distinct rules but that takes time and effort which delays other things. It's not going to happen tomorrow, or even a month from now but we can certainly try to address it in the future.
that these theoretical interpretations are not in any way proven - these
essay serves more as a pre-registration of my hypothesis in the proudest
traditions of the scientific method, so that none can say after the fact
that I fitted my hypothesis to the experimental results rather than
using the results to validate or disconfirm my prior suppositions. While
I would go so far to assert that they seem plausible and consistent with
the current research in the fields of High Magic and Tarot, I shall not
claim them as Truth until I have seen the evidence myself. (Take
nobody's word for it!)"
And no, not all people are capable of sharing their stories, this isn't 'my' story it is a representation of one aspect of my experiences alive on this earth manifested for a Serenwilde character that was potentially something I was going to work in to using IG if I felt i could. But I have never gotten around to develop Ena because I have been stuck in this position of being told rape doesn't exist, only in lore...which obviously makes no bloody sense. There are loads of examples of people using their real life experiences to develop character histories and general RP plots. This is about two aspects. My personal one which I did not make this about until they declared I was using something out of context, and how they critque books for the library system. They aren't the same problem, and they don't need to be resolved the same way.
Another reason I fight this is because heaven forbid you did decide one day want to explore what it would be like to express yourself through Lusternia to deal with something traumatic...how the hell would you feel being treated this way? So maybe if i can call the BS here and make them see what they are doing is wrong, you or someone else won't ever have to go through this crap either. But whatever, apparently I just love rape and make it all up for funsies.
Edit: I was going to make the same point as Portius but he made it. People should speak up on behalf of this book Portius is discussing, because it should be on the shelf! It is okay to be human and make errors. Admin, we know you aren't robots. We just want you to say sorry and work with us. The reason I am being so vocal about all of this is to help people to speak up and see that it is okay to tell admin no you are wrong. Of course I am more aggressive than anyone else. It is how I roll. But you can all speak up in your own ways. It's okay.
Can the library system of regulation for submissions be made more transparent, i.e. a definitive reason stated for why something is rejected, for the sake of current and future submissions being better honed by experienced librarians towards something fitting the standards expected for the game?
And might we consider creating a system of different categories for the library...fiction, nonfiction, opinions (for those that seem a blend of the two, needing RP to work out as factual or not, so great for scientific endeavors being published and worked on via RP engagement)?
I don't have a good response to this. That's why I acknowledged the contestation (and haven't addressed it other than that). From my point of view, without actually consulting the admin who initially did the rejection, it just looks like this was missed or glossed over. The only point I was trying to make there was that the rejection wasn't arbitrary 'we don't like it and so we're rejecting it' that's been implied but instead a 'we actually like it but it doesn't fit the rules laid out.'
That's the point that seems to be continuously made, that we'll just reject a book because we feel like it and that's just simply not true.
No one would have had this discussion if I hadn't of shared what I did. Because no one else has ever been told "We are gonna ban things because we have the right to, too bad." so if I had to put up with your bullying and nonsense all over discord and what not it was well worth it. Because books like the one Portius is discussing can now hopefully be shelved.
Only one person is sticking to the 'I am right, you are wrong' mantra and that's Enadonella.
Lets look at a sequence of posts.
From Devora (the bold is Enadonella bolding it for the next comment)
2) yes, there are people who can do it thoughtfully, but letting anyone talk about sexual violence in library works would likely get exploited in problematic ways that are hard to regulate. Best not to leave the door open for that kind of abuse.
Followed up by Enadonella
I have always maintained that if that were the reason given, I'd have been fine and accepted that because it is valid.
And two quotes she posted from the admin prior to that statement.
We are not marginalising sexual violence; we are deeming it to not be something we wish to include in our gameworld. Thank you.
Regarding appeal of the book regarding rape, we reserve the right to reject any submission for any reason. In this case, we felt your story was too explicit for Lusternia. There are no hard or fast guidelines except that we hope writers intending to distribute writing in Lusternia's public library system will refrain for sexual explicit or potentially triggering subject matter. Again, what constitutes that will be decided on a case-by-case basis in our sole and absolute discretion.
Apparently, that's a valid reason by your own reasoning, yet you still argued and continued your crusade, issuing and emailing.
So yes, continue your glorious campaign to right the wrongs of the library. To fight against the 'valid' reasoning you, yourself agreed with and 'always maintained'
Sorry, I missed this and it was recently pointed out to me. I am not sure how many times I asked for it to be pointed out where exactly I was explicitly sexual or where sexual violence was depicted so that I might have a chance at amending the offensive parts of the book. And again and again it was ignored. So, please. If someone can. I'd love some feedback on the book. Tell me what is too explicit. https://ada-young.appspot.com/pastebin/sgOO3bqD Cheers!
"LADIES AND GENTLEMEN! MAESTRA HAS LOST THE RACE!"
Also who are you, out of curiosity, @Maestra? I sense a wickedness surrounding your aura.
We are not going to issue any warnings or similar for anything said here, but We will note that what is causing Us to close it is the devolution of the debate into nothing but personal attacks.
Thank you to everyone who has made a case here, who has made suggestions and pointed out flaws. The Havens team have been watching throughout and discussing what can be done moving forward; the closure of this thread will not change that.