Families, Bloodbonding and Marriage.

I've always been a little annoyed by the way the system is set up right now that you cannot be married in order to find your family. My character got married before she was ever ina  family and now the only way to get parents or siblings is to divorce and then get adopted and then remarry. this hurts the family honour, not to mention it's a pain in the ass and gives you an unwanted divorced line. Just because you got married first doesn't suddenly mean that you no longer have a blood family, parents, siblings, etc.  Just because I'm married IRL doesnt mean my family is no longer my family. Now I assume it has something to do with coding and the way families tend ot work in Lusternia with the whole "whoever does the proposing is what family name you take" etc thing but honestly... if they can do it in Achaea so that you can be married AND still find parents...they can do it here. It's just a matter of actually doing it. Can we add that into the whole overhaul thing? cuz my almost 200 year old character needs parents damnit!!!
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Comments

  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    edited July 2015
    Yes please to all of this.

    Personally I've always wished there was a way to designate certain family members as adopted, to distinguish them from blood relations. Wouldn't change anything mechanically, just add a signifier to the relevant family relation lines - ie "He is a second generation member of House Shevat (adopted)."

    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • Throwing my hat in here, I'm stuck in a one person family because I can't bloodbond into the one I want to join.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    I don't want to hijack the thread, but I'm wondering what is the closest relation a character can marry? Is anyone fair game as long as "FAMILY RELATION <so and so>" returns "<so and so> bears no relation to you" ?
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • Daraius said:
    I don't want to hijack the thread, but I'm wondering what is the closest relation a character can marry? Is anyone fair game as long as "FAMILY RELATION <so and so>" returns "<so and so> bears no relation to you" ?
    GASP! HIJACKER! :P
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    Sorry I thought it was relevant! And the answer might inspire further complaints or suggestions for the family system.  =((
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • PortiusPortius Likes big books, cannot lie

    Daraius said:
    I don't want to hijack the thread, but I'm wondering what is the closest relation a character can marry? Is anyone fair game as long as "FAMILY RELATION <so and so>" returns "<so and so> bears no relation to you" ?

    My understanding (via a half-remembered discussion with Zitto after he issued to ask about that) was that anything that doesn't show up on family relation is fine, anyone that does show up cannot be married. I think that means you can marry anyone with more than three degrees of separation.
    Any sufficiently advanced pun is indistinguishable from comedy.
  • SilvanusSilvanus The Sparrowhawk
    Do Family relation (person)

    If its:

    family relation krackenor
    Krackenor is your great-nephew through Ashai's side.

    You can't marry, if its:

    family relation celina
    Celina is your distant relation.

    You can marry. Pretty sure.
    2014/04/19 01:38:01 - Leolamins drained 2000000 power to raise Silvanus as a Vernal Ascendant.
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    2015/05/24 06:03:07 - Silvanus drained 2000000 power to raise Arimisia as a Vernal Ascendant.
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  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    edited July 2015
    I see... It looks like things kind of break down at the nephew/uncle/cousin level

    Nihmriel is your mother.

    (Saaga is Nihmriel's sister)

    Saaga bears no relationship to you.

    (Llesvelt is Saaga's son)

    Llesvelt is your distant relation.

    (Khydan is Llesvelt's son)

    Khydan is your distant relation.

    And beyond immediate in-laws the system doesn't recognize anything.

    Sylandra is your wife.

    (Phoebus is Sylandra's sister)

    Phoebus is your sister-in-law.

    (Portius is Phoebus's son)

    Portius bears no relationship to you.



    Just to clarify, I'm not looking for prospects. Though it is a little weird that Daraius apparently could marry his aunt Saaga?

    There is also a non-zero chance that I don't exactly understand how the various degrees of cousins and aunts and uncles work irl.
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • Daraius said:
    stuff
    We Shevats broke the rules. Shh don't tell.
  • edited July 2015
    It is hard coded that once you bloodbond/adopt your stuck that way, even rejecting/divorcing keeps you in the family tree.. Someone once tried very hard to marry their bloodbonded sister some years ago.

    I would love to see a break in the bloodbonding/family system. I would have never bloodbonded if I had known years down the road my now 301 year old character can only marry in to other families because well only one other person is active in my tree, and they have stated they wished they hadn't been adopted.

    But if some people can get their name changed past the 30 hour mark. It is possible, but honestly with the overhaul.. It might not be considered.

    Currently Playing in: The doctors office. One more needle and I might just lose it again.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    Do you mean like how you can be bloodbonded as a progenitor of one family, then get adopted by another one?

    ************[ THE INCORPORATED CULTURED HOUSE OF WINDWHISPER ]*************
    Progenitors:
       (I) Shedrin Shevat <m: Tulemrah> <p: Nihmriel+Arel> [Rejected Family]


    Actually there's a few Windwhisper progenitors that have rejected the family and have non-Windwhisper parents. I think I don't fully comprehend bloodbonding.
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • Daraius said:
    Do you mean like how you can be bloodbonded as a progenitor of one family, then get adopted by another one?

    ************[ THE INCORPORATED CULTURED HOUSE OF WINDWHISPER ]*************
    Progenitors:
       (I) Shedrin Shevat <m: Tulemrah> <p: Nihmriel+Arel> [Rejected Family]


    Actually there's a few Windwhisper progenitors that have rejected the family and have non-Windwhisper parents. I think I don't fully comprehend bloodbonding.
    I wasn't bloodbonded into Windwhisper. I was married to Leta that was bloodbonded in.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    Oh durr, that would probably explain some of the others too. Ignore me, it's late.  I-)
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • On the subject of cousin marrying (not that I'm an expert cough cough) It's really interesting that there's a certain relationship (I think it's first cousin once removed) that shows a relation only one way. Tomir and Alexandrea tried to get married because only one of us checked family relation first, and it was not the one with the "you're veering into redneck territory" notice. At least it used to be that way, and I don't know why they would fix it. Seems pretty low priority.
    The purpose of writing is to inflate weak ideas, obscure pure reasoning, and inhibit clarity. With a little practice, writing can be an intimidating and impenetrable fog!
  • SylandraSylandra Join Queue for Mafia Games The Last Mafia Game
    The only thing I would really like is if bloodbonded siblings showed up as siblings on family tree. </3

    ...But as I just logged in to a bunch of super neat changes to the family system, I would like to add a belated thank you for the various cool additions. So thanks, admin!
    Daraius said:
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  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    Does it only take one progenitor to bloodbond a new progenitor member? Can people enter the progenitor generation through bloodbonding even after the family's been active and growing for ages? Can multiple progenitors be considering a different new sibling at the same time?

    Asking for a friend.
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • KaimanahiKaimanahi The One True Queen
    Daraius said:
    I don't want to hijack the thread, but I'm wondering what is the closest relation a character can marry? Is anyone fair game as long as "FAMILY RELATION <so and so>" returns "<so and so> bears no relation to you" ?
    I believe it is anything beyond your second cousin or first cousin twice removed. And, well, no one directly down your root (great great great great great grandchildren).
    Daraius said:
    Does it only take one progenitor to bloodbond a new progenitor member? Can people enter the progenitor generation through bloodbonding even after the family's been active and growing for ages? Can multiple progenitors be considering a different new sibling at the same time? Asking for a friend.
    Anyone within the progenitor tier can initiate the bloodbond, but I think you need a second progenitor to actually accept them. Yes to everything else.
    image
  • Throwing a small thing in here, wouldn't it also help if a married couple didn't have to taking from one family and giving to another? It seems to cause more trouble than it's worth that if you marry someone you have to take their name, or their yours. What about an option for neutrality, that you are married, but keep your own names.

    It's a bit 'traditional' and outdated to have it necessary to take your partner's name or something.

    I also agree @Nyxx's primary point. Marriage should not stop you finding a family.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    So a marriage wouldn't add +1 to either family's roster?
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • EritheylEritheyl ** Trigger Warning **
    What happens to the kids, then?
    Crumkane, Lord of Epicurean Delights says, "WAS IT INDEED ON FIRE, ERITHEYL."

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    With a deep reverb, Contemptible Sutekh says, "CEASE YOUR INFERNAL ENERGY, ERITHEYL."
  • PortiusPortius Likes big books, cannot lie
    Let them pick, or else have the couple choose where their children go when they get married.
    Any sufficiently advanced pun is indistinguishable from comedy.
  • DaraiusDaraius Shevat The juror's taco spot
    I kind of like that there's a give and take with marriages. To me it seems like it would encourage families to be compelling enough that members wouldn't want to marry out, cough @Saleo cough. I'd be totally in favor of a way for folks to somehow keep access to their original family aether and newsboard even if they marry out, though. 
    I used to make cakes.

    Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
  • Can we... can we just hijack this thread to discuss in a productive fashion how the family system is amazing and unique but also ultimately pointless and not introducing a healthy and fun system of conflict into the game, and it would be really nice if we could brainstorm and maybe come up with an alternative perk proposal other than 'get most honourable, get council position' as the end goal? Because I know I myself am sick of being lied to, badmouthed, painted as some crazed grude-holding unreasonable control-freak, simply because I get upset about people lying to me constantly over something so simple as marriage/adoption! 

    This system, while a really great idea at base level, only lends itself to destroying each other and tearing each other down. There's no point to trying to build up the other families in your city because they're simply a threat. While this might seem like great roleplay at surface level, if it's introducing the idea of beginning the process of adopting people out of the portal who have no idea what's going on, it's not healthy. 

    I really think that a better way of handling this whole thing would be to introduce some other perks or roleplay bonuses related to family type and family honour. There could also be a better way of handling alliances and pledges and make it worth it other than just the idea of inflating your numbers if you're a banner/greathouse. Make it more fun and enjoyable by making it less about a single end goal and making it more about your own internal family and what you can do for each other. 
    image
  • What about instead of a ruling council position, the end game perk for a great house is a free basic homestead? (Upgrades still cost dem creds)
  • Or greathouses can buy the initial homestead at a reduced rate and your family honour level lets you unlock upgrades to it like adding NPCs that react to members, area messages, etc. A quest we can do that adds a small boost to the culture score of the city, that sort of thing. We should all want all our families to succeed, not just the one. That would give me a reason to actually want to do things.
    image
  • @ People commenting on kids.

    Back in the day. In the old old old days. Those very old days (I miss you Fain) There was this archaic thing done called 'Founding a family' which meant you could be adopted into a family, marry, and then form a new family with your wife. I know it's not done nowadays, but you know, all families started that way or another. Marriage or bloodbonding.

    Kids have the choice anyway which name to pick, as they can pay 10k gold and use 'lineage' name instead of their official family one. Instead of making a group of people have to be involved in one conflict, have them be able to -CHOOSE- whether they want to be in the conflict, ignore it, or try to solve it.
  • PortiusPortius Likes big books, cannot lie
    Silvanus said:
    Using Family Honour to buy things would be awesome, instead of a number just getting bigger and bigger to earn a Culture Score (the real reason of being MHF, +500 culture points).

    Commenting on this specifically. I'd love anything that removed MHF's point blob from culture. Self-interest aside, it's not a terribly interesting category. That could change if it wasn't so static, but I'd rather pull it out entirely and turn family honor into a currency for buying things. Which could and probably should include temporary culture points, so that family can stay relevant to culture without it just being a big unmoving brick. Maybe have a pool of X family culture points available for each year that cities get in proportion to the amount of honor their families put into culture instead of into other things. Makes it more interesting and interactive.
    Any sufficiently advanced pun is indistinguishable from comedy.
  • I wish I had something constructive to add, but all I can really say is that I am very dissatisfied with the system as it is, and the behaviors it seems to inspire in people. So, definite yes to something needing fixed.

  • What other sorts of things could honour be used to buy? 

     
    image
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