Well, for warriors you have a large list that work.
Aslaran and Loboshigaru are all-around good. You could argue Taurian as well. Orclach, Krokani, Igasho, Tae'dae, and Dwarf each have a native weapon and therefore are stronger than a normal warrior would be with those weapons. Decent with others as well. Elfen for guild spec.
For HS, I'm suggesting basically putting any race that will work well with the HS on the recommended list, leaving poor or might-be-okay choices in the neutral list.
I've left 'hard to play' ones alone... do you guys mind sharing why you picked as many as you did? I feel like reading this maybe I should change a minimalist approach.
If your Recommended list has no options a newbie likes, they will ignore your recommendations and pick something off the Neutral list instead. If the Neutral list has everything except the two worst and two best options, it probably contains an equal number of good and bad choices. Newbies are therefore more likely to make bad choices if the Recommended list is too short to cover a wide range of preferences.
It sounds like there should be a way of distinguishing what races are encouraged/banned for rp reasons, and which ones are encouraged/discouraged for mechanical reasons.
I'd be uncomfortable with putting any other race as equally "encouraged" as trill or lucidian, because from a city and guild identity and lore standpoint, they're not. There also aren't any races I'd be okay with us restricting, even though there are some really terrible for bard races out there. (maybe illithoid)
Also mechanics change, and some of this seems pretty subjective (although that may be because my combat experience amounts to throw lots of knocking people down and aeon around and try not to die.)
I'm really tempted to ban Illithoid and Viscanti, but don't think I'd get away with it.
Pretty sure I'm going to vehemently oppose the banning of any races for the Institute, myself.
No need. The Institute won't be banning any races. Not even Dracnari. We accept anyone with a passion for science and the desire to discover the truths of the world. *forumRP*
Everyone is a genius. But if you judge a fish on its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.
It sounds like there should be a way of distinguishing what races are encouraged/banned for rp reasons, and which ones are encouraged/discouraged for mechanical reasons.
This.
Everiine said: The reason population is low isn't because there are too many orgs. It's because so many facets of the game are outright broken and protected by those who benefit from it being that way. An overabundance of gimmicks (including game-breaking ones), artifacts that destroy any concept of balance, blatant pay-to-win features, and an obsession with convenience that makes few things actually worthwhile all contribute to the game's sad decline.
Monks rely on a combination of STR + DEX. If memory serves correct, dex significantly factors into PVE damage while STR impacts PVP damage. I forget which stat gives higher wounds.
High levels of constitution ~OR~ balance bonus is a secondary consideration for all monks. Of course the Illithoid/Kephera conflict should be hard-wired into monk racial restrictions.
Here is the list for Nekotai (but could be generalized for monks at large).
Not to over complicate things, but I might suggest allowing the ability to write a short comment about each race, so that newbies can make a more informed decision and better understand why some races are categorized in a certain way.
I will give brief mention about racial options in a CGHELP STINGS file, with a more elaborate response in GHELP GUILDRACES. The collegium scroll will cross-reference the guild scroll. Use the tools that you already have at your disposal (so as not to overcomplicate things).
Not to over complicate things, but I might suggest allowing the ability to write a short comment about each race, so that newbies can make a more informed decision and better understand why some races are categorized in a certain way.
I will give brief mention about racial options in a CGHELP STINGS file, with a more elaborate response in GHELP GUILDRACES. The collegium scroll will cross-reference the guild scroll. Use the tools that you already have at your disposal (so as not to overcomplicate things).
I was under the impression that the newbie would be prompted to choose a race before the opportunity to be directed to an alternate scroll, but if this is not the case then it is a good suggestion!
If memory serves correct, there was a guild priv GUILD RACES that gives a percent based indication on a race-by-race basis. I don't remember if this was for "all" members or actives only. After scanning through GUILD PRIVS, I no longer see this command. Then again, my eyesight isn't what it once was. Perhaps I am overlooking the obvious.
For now I'll assume this older syntax was wiped in favor of the new GUILD RACES suite of commands. As a request, would it be possible to reactivate this readout for guild administrators as a ledger command? Something to the effect of GUILD LEDGER RACES.
After all, it would inform the GA about the popularity of racial profiles, and further enhance the GUILD RACES selection process from an admin perspective. Better admin decision-making also means better player support for all members- new and old.
Not to over complicate things, but I might suggest allowing the ability to write a short comment about each race, so that newbies can make a more informed decision and better understand why some races are categorized in a certain way.
I will give brief mention about racial options in a CGHELP STINGS file, with a more elaborate response in GHELP GUILDRACES. The collegium scroll will cross-reference the guild scroll. Use the tools that you already have at your disposal (so as not to overcomplicate things).
I was under the impression that the newbie would be prompted to choose a race before the opportunity to be directed to an alternate scroll, but if this is not the case then it is a good suggestion!
Time to create a new character to get first person perspective on the matter!
If memory serves correct, there was a guild priv GUILD RACES that gives a percent based indication on a race-by-race basis. I don't remember if this was for "all" members or actives only. After scanning through GUILD PRIVS, I no longer see this command. Then again, my eyesight isn't what it once was. Perhaps I am overlooking the obvious.
For now I'll assume this older syntax was wiped in favor of the new GUILD RACES suite of commands. As a request, would it be possible to reactivate this readout for guild administrators as a ledger command? Something to the effect of GUILD LEDGER RACES.
After all, it would inform the GA about the popularity of racial profiles, and further enhance the GUILD RACES selection process from an admin perspective. Better admin decision-making also means better player support for all members- new and old.
You're thinking of GUILD LEDGER MEMBERS, which shows the name, race, level, guild rank and lastlogin and offices of everyone in the guild.
Maybe I am half-remembering the GUILD LEDGER MEMBERS (which I did have full awareness about previous to my posting), or half-muddled the idea with an old forum post. I do apologize for any misinformation or wrongful accusation.
That aside, could a GUILD LEDGER RACES and GUILD LEDGER RACES FULL feature be implemented? This would be a slight variation on the LEDGER MEMBERS syntax. Basically I want something that looks like the following:
Aslaran : 17%
Dracnari : 2%
Dwarf : 1%
Elfen : 0%
Faeling : 5%
Furrikin : 6%
Human : 3%
Igasho : 0%
Illithoid : 46%
Kephera : 0%
Krokani : 2%
Loboshigaru : 13%
Lucidian : 0%
Merian : 0%
Mugwump : 0%
Orclach : 2%
Tae'dae : 1%
Taurian : 1%
Trill : 1%
Viscanti : 0%
The obvious reason would be to better inform guild administrator about player preferred races (despite guild admin trying to use the new GUILD RACES commands to channel players into select races and admonish other newbie racial selections).
EDIT: Stats posted to the tenths decimal place would be awesome, but hundredths even more so.
Faeling with psymet is actually really good for Nekotai, at least that is my personal finding. Psymet really offsets the lower CON. I was clearing out UV with ease at level 70, and that is without a curing system and just relying on firstaid. Will remain to be seen how it works for combat though. But another upside is that it makes for pretty decent influencing to get through the early levels
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The curing bonuses Faeling get do offset the con, the low Str is the kicker, though balance bonus works in rather nicely.
It is, however, a very YMMV based race, there's little you gain over being say, Aslaran, but that's less of a reflection on Faeling and more Aslaranmasterrace.
The divine voice
of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Congratulations,
Morkarion, you are the Bringer of Death indeed."
You see Estarra the Eternal shout, "Morkarion is no more! Mourn the mortal! But welcome True Ascendant Karlach, of the Realm of Death!
What would strike me as big and clever is to have a way to add comments on the races to say why races are good/bad/neutral.
Please note: I deliberately play a very flawed character. Just because he says or does something, does not mean I agree with it. He's a bit of a <censored> really
Please, please do not add races to the restricted list just because they are not mechanically optimal for your guild archetype if it means that newbies cannot choose them at all. Please keep in mind that not all newbies are looking for fast technical advancement/have any intention to participate in combat (did anyone gasp?) and that some would rather just roleplay.
I once roleplayed a loboshigaru bard who became frustrated at snapping her lute's strings with her claws, however the ensuing roleplay engaged in by her guild members encouraged her to keep trying despite her racial disinclination towards string-plucking. It was a wonderful, immersive experience; especially for us experienced roleplayers, the challenge of roleplaying at odds with conventions can be incredibly rewarding.
That said, I agree with and would also like to see the fruition of previous comments suggesting a fourth category for discouraged races as well as the ability to add commentary to the lists.
Tonight amidst the mountaintops And endless starless night Singing how the wind was lost Before an earthly flight
Actually, to not use the restricted races to remove certain egregriously bad choices from a newbie's options would be a huge mistake in my opinion. Certainly, playing a mugwump warrior or an orclach mage is definitely possible from an RP point of view, and can be very, very fulfilling for both the roleplayer as well as the guild. Such "mechanically horrible" choices can allow for rich and engaging expressions of creativity.
However, hardcoded removal of an option is implemented to protect true newbies. Those who join the game not solely for RP, but also for the mechanical enjoyment of bashing, influencing etc. And for as long as statpacks are not coming to Lusternia, then newbies will continue to need such protection. If not an experienced player telling them that choosing to be an orclach as a guardian is a horrible, horrible choice and should immediately be changed, then by hard-coded restrictions. An experienced roleplayer can jolly well choose any race and then reincarnate to their RP race. Those true newbies who chose a mechanically recommended race but then later decide they want to roleplay as a mugwump warrior can use their reincarnation for that as well.
Is there data on newbies picking bad races for their class and then quitting the game because of that? I'm not convinced this was an actual problem that needed to be solved, and I really hate the implementation of the solution.
You should not be forced by mechanics to not be able to pick a race simply because it's not optimal for the guild.
The only restricted races should be those that the guild does not allow, ie kephera in nekotai/ninjakari, illithoid in shofangi/tahtetso, etc.
If I roll an alt, I should not have to use up my free reincarnation simply because the guild administrator decided that tae'dae won't make a good bard.
I believe the restricted category should be used to prevent making the novice reincarnate right out of the portal because their guild does not allow the race they chose, and for no other reason.
A fourth category of "discouraged" will cover the bases of true newbies and protect them from making terrible mechanical choices, without preventing them from picking a race that, though disadvantaged, is still allowed in their guild/city/commune.
This fourth category will also allow you to separate the truly optimal races into the recommended category, while leaving the useable ones for "neutral"
A whisper from the trees and a frosty presence tells you, secretly, "But you are strong, little
flower, and wise." The voice shifts and expands, becoming more real. "And everything you just said
in the ritual made me feel safer. You should, too."
Actually, to not use the restricted races to remove certain egregriously bad choices from a newbie's options would be a huge mistake in my opinion. Certainly, playing a mugwump warrior or an orclach mage is definitely possible from an RP point of view, and can be very, very fulfilling for both the roleplayer as well as the guild. Such "mechanically horrible" choices can allow for rich and engaging expressions of creativity.
However, hardcoded removal of an option is implemented to protect true newbies. Those who join the game not solely for RP, but also for the mechanical enjoyment of bashing, influencing etc. And for as long as statpacks are not coming to Lusternia, then newbies will continue to need such protection. If not an experienced player telling them that choosing to be an orclach as a guardian is a horrible, horrible choice and should immediately be changed, then by hard-coded restrictions. An experienced roleplayer can jolly well choose any race and then reincarnate to their RP race. Those true newbies who chose a mechanically recommended race but then later decide they want to roleplay as a mugwump warrior can use their reincarnation for that as well.
All of what @Parua said; also, the commentary on the lists would solve this issue provided said true newbies are capable of reading.
Also, speaking of RP and overall game immersion, experienced players speaking with newbies regarding race optimization as well as other things should be encouraged, no?
Tonight amidst the mountaintops And endless starless night Singing how the wind was lost Before an earthly flight
However, hardcoded removal of an option is implemented to protect true newbies. Those who join the game not solely for RP, but also for the mechanical enjoyment of bashing, influencing etc. And for as long as statpacks are not coming to Lusternia, then newbies will continue to need such protection. If not an experienced player telling them that choosing to be an orclach as a guardian is a horrible, horrible choice and should immediately be changed, then by hard-coded restrictions. An experienced roleplayer can jolly well choose any race and then reincarnate to their RP race. Those true newbies who chose a mechanically recommended race but then later decide they want to roleplay as a mugwump warrior can use their reincarnation for that as well.
The problem is that the solution, as it is, affects not only true newbies, but anyone else, regardless of their range of experience, who is creating a new character. Someone who chooses a race for the rp of it should not be forced to use their free reincarnation to get that rp. After all, they may choose their mind.
While we could use existing help files to discuss races, it seems like a neater solution would simply be to allow for a fourth category of "discouraged." Or provide an opportunity to point to a collegium or guild help file with more information (although having to write that in character is going to be less than ideal) Or else make it so that the current "restricted" races doesn't actually prevent someone from choosing that race. Or allow brief comments to accompany the racial selection.
All of these would allow the newbie to avoid making mechanically unfavourable choices, while still allowing experienced, or at least curious players, to explore other avenues of rp.
If a newbie chooses a "discouraged" race, then, well, that was on them. If they want to change, they can always use their free reincarnation. And, since they are at least aware of the possibility of changing races, they may be more likely to do so than simply quitting.
You should not be forced by mechanics to not be able to pick a race simply because it's not optimal for the guild.
No one has said optimal races only, otherwise every Knight guild would pigeonhole you into Aslaran.
You're confusing "optimal" with "races that aren't utterly terrible" there's a massive difference.
If you've been reading, you'll see there's been talk of putting mechanically bad races in the restricted category, which is what @Parua (and I, and everyone asking for a 'discouraged' category and the ability to make brief notes on each race) objects to.
Comments
I'd be uncomfortable with putting any other race as equally "encouraged" as trill or lucidian, because from a city and guild identity and lore standpoint, they're not. There also aren't any races I'd be okay with us restricting, even though there are some really terrible for bard races out there. (maybe illithoid)
Also mechanics change, and some of this seems pretty subjective (although that may be because my combat experience amounts to throw lots of knocking people down and aeon around and try not to die.)
Means it's half based on Int and half based on Cha
An admin did a forum post (on the old forums) with a breakdown of racial percentages, though.
You have received a new honour! Congratulations! On this day, you have shown your willingness to ensure a bug-free Lusternia for everyone to enjoy. The face of Iosai the Anomaly unfolds before you, and within you grows the knowledge that you have earned the elusive and rare honour of membership in Her Order.
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It is, however, a very YMMV based race, there's little you gain over being say, Aslaran, but that's less of a reflection on Faeling and more Aslaranmasterrace.
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Congratulations, Morkarion, you are the Bringer of Death indeed."
You see Estarra the Eternal shout, "Morkarion is no more! Mourn the mortal! But welcome True Ascendant Karlach, of the Realm of Death!
Tonight amidst the mountaintops
And endless starless night
Singing how the wind was lost
Before an earthly flight
However, hardcoded removal of an option is implemented to protect true newbies. Those who join the game not solely for RP, but also for the mechanical enjoyment of bashing, influencing etc. And for as long as statpacks are not coming to Lusternia, then newbies will continue to need such protection. If not an experienced player telling them that choosing to be an orclach as a guardian is a horrible, horrible choice and should immediately be changed, then by hard-coded restrictions. An experienced roleplayer can jolly well choose any race and then reincarnate to their RP race. Those true newbies who chose a mechanically recommended race but then later decide they want to roleplay as a mugwump warrior can use their reincarnation for that as well.
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."
Tonight amidst the mountaintops
And endless starless night
Singing how the wind was lost
Before an earthly flight
The problem is that the solution, as it is, affects not only true newbies, but anyone else, regardless of their range of experience, who is creating a new character. Someone who chooses a race for the rp of it should not be forced to use their free reincarnation to get that rp. After all, they may choose their mind.
While we could use existing help files to discuss races, it seems like a neater solution would simply be to allow for a fourth category of "discouraged." Or provide an opportunity to point to a collegium or guild help file with more information (although having to write that in character is going to be less than ideal) Or else make it so that the current "restricted" races doesn't actually prevent someone from choosing that race. Or allow brief comments to accompany the racial selection.
All of these would allow the newbie to avoid making mechanically unfavourable choices, while still allowing experienced, or at least curious players, to explore other avenues of rp.
If a newbie chooses a "discouraged" race, then, well, that was on them. If they want to change, they can always use their free reincarnation. And, since they are at least aware of the possibility of changing races, they may be more likely to do so than simply quitting.
You're confusing "optimal" with "races that aren't utterly terrible" there's a massive difference.
The divine voice of Avechna, the Avenger reverberates powerfully, "Congratulations, Morkarion, you are the Bringer of Death indeed."
You see Estarra the Eternal shout, "Morkarion is no more! Mourn the mortal! But welcome True Ascendant Karlach, of the Realm of Death!
Estarra the Eternal says, "Give Shevat the floor please."