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Comments, Concerns, and General input on Dream event

ArcanisArcanis
edited December 2015 in Common Grounds
Some things I would like to highlight concerning the recent event to perhaps assist with the making of future events. This will include both administrator and player behavior during.


- Before a single day had even passed, players were bringing in OOC theories straight into the event. People were spouting that it was a dream, and fake, when there was no proof to give for it yet. I at least ask for players to try and maintain a little RP decorum with events and try to play up to the role. If you are shouting swears at gods, you'll get zapped. Suddenly this was seen as "unfair" when done to the higher gods...yet has always been the case when done with Elders...


- After roughly a day and a half had passed within the 'new world order', players were already receiving visions of "their gods contacting them". Im not certain whether the Admin felt it was time, because of all the early Dream assumptions being made, or if it was scheduled to be so, but it would have been more realistic if it had lasted a bit longer before the unveiling of it all being a dream.

https://33.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lnroeu7e3U1qb10wfo1_500.gif


- Im going to assume that the admin had planned to just "go wild" with the new higher god roles? While this is fun and all, it also made some problems. Gods responded to threats and things in the best way they knew how: Zap, Maggot, Silence. the Higher gods would be appearing and making their demands as they saw fit. Dont agree? Zap. It would have added more of an interesting element to have the actions more plotted out, rather than "Go forth and rule the world".

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/oEuC8HxWr5w4Y8AtlV-9thJZfvRGs0CEh2yfXBBYnp586RDCfrzy9YJdGcEJgQOJNPzJmq43fVaeJEZ5U_EXWblnEcA=w506-h285-n


- A general pet peeve of mine to Lusternian events, is the "SUDDENLY HAPPENS" factor. Suddenly a cure is found to fixing the plague, go get it! Suddenly a way is uncovered for entering the location, go fight! Etc. It feels like there is no buildup for it, and people are caught off-guard, and then saddened at having missed the event. Take the Eisenglass Needle. That just suddenly happened. It would be great if there was at the least a buildup of 1 day to a "Solution being found", in order to let people know to be around The same can be said for suddenly attacking the Higher Gods. One moment, a new shrine is given, and it feels like the collecting of Foam will be something done for at least 2 days. Then, I discover, 6 hours later, they were defeated...


- Bringing back up the "plotting out" point, I'd like to bring up the example of Orgs. It was generally assumed that since this was a "temporary" situation, that all the orgs would be doing some crazy things to get some advantages. Hallifax got to build their own Deathstar and obliterate Zoaka. Glomdoring got to wyrd Hifarae. Serenwilde was spreading their nuisance of plants everywhere. Celest got to return the Crystal Sea. Not all the orgs felt as loved frankly. Magnagora got basically nothing, and frankly this comes back to another point of each god being told to "Go wild!". They admin behind each god role focused on their preferred Org. now I know @Zvoltz you have said and likely will say again that "we dont have a preferred org we work for", but frankly this example alone will disprove that. Each God was playing it up and making a fun concept for their preferred org, and ignored the others. Droc herself said she couldnt be around that much, so Karagash was basically awol until near the end of the event. From what I've also seen, some gods would promise their org something (such as remaking the sea of despair into the crystal sea) then relay their new project for the "dream" to the team, which they'd start working on. Remaking the rooms of the Crystal sea alone took hours (quoted from Drocilla), so that is also a lot of time wasted for 1 singular org, that the 1 active god there was pushing for, while others got squat.

So yes, I'll have to actually asked (and I cant believe I have to ask this) that -all- the orgs be taken into consideration to receive the SAME treatment, if it is for all of them. Dont just focus on your preferred orgs. Magnagora frankly felt pretty damn cheated in this event, and its players felt like they were denied an experience (I can even attest this by quotes from these players). Dont think Magnagora didnt give suggestions. We gave an astounding amount, for even small things, but frankly, no one was there listening. Now as much as ms. Frai/Mysrai would say "Maybe it is because we just dont like interacting with you magnagoran players?" then that is also not true. Mag has always generally behaved quite maturely with their administrators, and to only put a spotlight on "Mag bad acts" when the others are highlighted as never doing wrong, isnt fair.

http://abkldesigns.com/clipart1/nesan5.gif


(and what do you want for christmas?)

- Why was a shrine to the Higher Gods placed...only to be removed in roughly 6 hours later with the event ending? I barely did anything with it. Was this just a random idea you came up with?




Guess that's all I have for now, take the commentary as you wish, I'm not even certain it'll really change anything.
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Comments

  • ArcanisArcanis
    edited December 2015
    Ieptix said:
    I'll just leave my response at this: most of your assumptions about what happened behind the scenes are wrong.


    Well then by all means, go ahead and correct me. A lot of us in Mag  would like to know why we were ignored. I'd also love to know why the plotting felt so spontaneous as well.
  • EodhEodh
    Speaking as a Gaudiguchian whose Higher God @Frai didn't really do anything flashy, the event was awesome (with reservations, particularly the thing at the end with the foam and the honours line). I'm not speaking for the whole city, but from what I saw, we generally didn't rely on admin attention to "do" the event (in fact, I think we got attention after we did some shenanigans).

    From the citywide riot highlighted with @Subotai's memorable one-liner, to @Synkarin's interrogation of Frai, @Talan's expeditions to try and find answers, @Steingrim's propaganda, and more, I felt like our enjoyment of the event was mostly because we engaged each other and didn't put a lot of pressure on Frai to "give" us something.



  • SalomeSalome
    Estarra said:
    You never know how difficult it is to run an event behind the scenes until you do! I usually don't get into discussing behind the scenes, but in this case I will note the higher gods were often played by multiple people--including myself! Also, speaking for just myself, how people RP/roleplay with me affected how much I wanted to participate/interact. I had a lovely time with Serane. With Karagash, there was only so much I could take logging in and having the CT channel generally just be belligerent. I was like, "Really? A god appears that has the power to zap, maggot, etc., and your RP is to insult him or be jerks?" I mean, fine, if you want to back me to a corner where the only appropriate response is to zap, go for it, but it doesn't really make me want to RP with you (exception was Arcanis who was fun but it was drowned in the other behavior). On a small tangent, this also goes for regular god roles as well. Those who really treat their patrons well generally have more active/responsive patrons. Those orgs who treat their patrons like crap generally have patrons that either don't like to interact much or the org gets such a reputation that no one wants to RP a godrole with them.
    That was you as Serane? I am so pleased and happy you had a good time. I did too!
    The apple is cold, crisp, and sour as the juices fill your mouth. As you consume the fruit, you glimpse, for a moment, a massive, shadowy figure, Her snow-white hair framing a perfect, icy-eyed visage. Beneath you, a vast, perfect web of silken strands lies - and, for a moment, you realize that you too are part of it, weaver and strand both - and home.
  • RiviusRivius Your resident wolf puppy
    edited December 2015
    Estarra said:
    A god appears that has the power to zap, maggot, etc., and your RP is to insult him or be jerks?" I mean, fine, if you want to back me to a corner where the only appropriate response is to zap, go for it, but it doesn't really make me want to RP with you (exception was Arcanis who was fun but it was drowned in the other behavior).
    Oh yikes. I was pretty belligerent with the gods at one point, but at that point Rivius had already decided they were antagonists! Hope I didn't make it not-fun for anyone.

    Overall, I loved the event from start to finish.
  • MarcellaMarcella
    edited December 2015
    nevermind anything I say about negative divine interaction and RPing opposition is just gonna get me beat up
  • EstarraEstarra
    Salome said:
    That was you as Serane? I am so pleased and happy you had a good time. I did too!
    Like I said, I was only Serane or any god occasionally! I don't know if the good time you had was with me or not!
    image
    image
  • XenthosXenthos Shadow Lord
    Rivius said:
    Estarra said:
    A god appears that has the power to zap, maggot, etc., and your RP is to insult him or be jerks?" I mean, fine, if you want to back me to a corner where the only appropriate response is to zap, go for it, but it doesn't really make me want to RP with you (exception was Arcanis who was fun but it was drowned in the other behavior).
    Oh yikes. I was pretty belligerent with the gods at one point, but at that point Rivius had already decided they were antagonists! Hope I didn't make it not-fun for anyone.
    Pretty sure it's a case of how you're being belligerent.  If it's just abrasive, "we're not going to give you any room to interact with us except zapping / force of strength" (which is Estarra seems to be talking about) then I can see it not really being fun.  Killing people with god-powers probably has to get old after a while.

    Clearly it's possible to be anti-God and still provide a good experience though; see the shout-out to Serane. :)  (We had fun with Serane too, @Estarra !)
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  • XenthosXenthos Shadow Lord
    Salome said:
    Estarra said:
    You never know how difficult it is to run an event behind the scenes until you do! I usually don't get into discussing behind the scenes, but in this case I will note the higher gods were often played by multiple people--including myself! Also, speaking for just myself, how people RP/roleplay with me affected how much I wanted to participate/interact. I had a lovely time with Serane. With Karagash, there was only so much I could take logging in and having the CT channel generally just be belligerent. I was like, "Really? A god appears that has the power to zap, maggot, etc., and your RP is to insult him or be jerks?" I mean, fine, if you want to back me to a corner where the only appropriate response is to zap, go for it, but it doesn't really make me want to RP with you (exception was Arcanis who was fun but it was drowned in the other behavior). On a small tangent, this also goes for regular god roles as well. Those who really treat their patrons well generally have more active/responsive patrons. Those orgs who treat their patrons like crap generally have patrons that either don't like to interact much or the org gets such a reputation that no one wants to RP a godrole with them.
    That was you as Serane? I am so pleased and happy you had a good time. I did too!
    She said that they shared the roles, so it may not ALWAYS have been her.
    image
  • AyisdraAyisdra
    Estarra said:
    You never know how difficult it is to run an event behind the scenes until you do! I usually don't get into discussing behind the scenes, but in this case I will note the higher gods were often played by multiple people--including myself! Also, speaking for just myself, how people RP/roleplay with me affected how much I wanted to participate/interact. I had a lovely time with Serane. With Karagash, there was only so much I could take logging in and having the CT channel generally just be belligerent. I was like, "Really? A god appears that has the power to zap, maggot, etc., and your RP is to insult him or be jerks?" I mean, fine, if you want to back me to a corner where the only appropriate response is to zap, go for it, but it doesn't really make me want to RP with you (exception was Arcanis who was fun but it was drowned in the other behavior). On a small tangent, this also goes for regular god roles as well. Those who really treat their patrons well generally have more active/responsive patrons. Those orgs who treat their patrons like crap generally have patrons that either don't like to interact much or the org gets such a reputation that no one wants to RP a godrole with them.

    A god that kidnapped everyone and made it look like the gods died - How else would one who is faithful to the Elders react besides insulting this new god?

    And then there is the secular people like @Portius who dislike all gods for reasons. Do these people make the gods go 'well, they don't like us, I might as well not patron for them'?
  • MarcellaMarcella
    edited December 2015
    actually nevermind nevermind - I'm sad that you find 'oh, your RP is to insult me and to be jerks I don't want to play' is a thing. Because that's what I live for. I absolutely loved @Darvellan star thing. I'm also open to my character having changes of mind/heart due to interactions, like @Yomoigu saw when he convinced my character that 'all elder gods are automatically bad' isn't exactly true.

    Interactions of just zap/maggot/screw you is something that validates Marcella's beliefs, not opposes them.

    I thought that maybe, gods would appreciate having actual ideological discussions with people who don't necessarily agree with them, or want them to perish, because it's always seemed to me like all they really do is have orders full of sycophants who try to get favors at all costs. 

    By being so belligerant to Morgfyre I'm inviting RP. I'm inviting his order and him to discuss me, or send assassins after me, or try to get me kicked out of the city. I welcome adversarial RP because it pumps my blood.

    To hear that, like Ayisdra said, it just drives Gods off instead of making them want to play more? It used to make me just think 'well, they just don't have the thick skin enough to be Mag in the first place, good riddance.' Now I'm just starting to get sad about it.
  • FalaeronFalaeron Jolteon
    I'm sure this was very exciting to everyone else, but it did come at the cost of making my experience as someone who was a newbie at the wrong place and time much more difficult. This is not meant to be a post to whine but it is probably something that might be worth considering because if I had been completely new to Iron Realm games I can totally see myself giving up very quickly.

    I walked into the flower right outside the Aetherplex Chamber and got killed a few times before I was told I could just TELEPORT AETHERPLEX. Unfortunately at the time I was trying to go to Toronada and didn't know I could just go through the Aetherplex to one of the other cities/communes and walk from there so I ended dying/being trapped for a little bit. I probably could have avoided a couple of the deaths if I had been more careful.

    While I am sure losing Hallifax was an inconvenience for all citizens, it was particularly inconvenienced by it. Luckily I had completed my collegium quests the day before so at least I got past that stage of my novicehood. A couple of the requirements for my guild's entrance test couldn't be completed. Shonjir heard my plight and let me pass without having to fulfil those requirements. Even after I was promoted from being a novice it was very hard to learn skills without a tutor.

    The disfavour was probably the biggest inconvenience for me. I went from over 3k to under 2k health/ego which made it almost too difficult to hunt/influence in the areas where I had been progressing in. I didn't actually notice I had lost all of those vitals until I went hunting and almost died doing something that was fairly easy for me before. It ended up being a huge disincentive for me to go hunting/influencing.

    With that all said, thanks to everyone who made the last couple of days more fun for me!
  • ArimisiaArimisia
    edited December 2015
    Estarra said:
    You never know how difficult it is to run an event behind the scenes until you do! I usually don't get into discussing behind the scenes, but in this case I will note the higher gods were often played by multiple people--including myself! Also, speaking for just myself, how people RP/roleplay with me affected how much I wanted to participate/interact. I had a lovely time with Serane. With Karagash, there was only so much I could take logging in and having the CT channel generally just be belligerent. I was like, "Really? A god appears that has the power to zap, maggot, etc., and your RP is to insult him or be jerks?" I mean, fine, if you want to back me to a corner where the only appropriate response is to zap, go for it, but it doesn't really make me want to RP with you (exception was Arcanis who was fun but it was drowned in the other behavior). On a small tangent, this also goes for regular god roles as well. Those who really treat their patrons well generally have more active/responsive patrons. Those orgs who treat their patrons like crap generally have patrons that either don't like to interact much or the org gets such a reputation that no one wants to RP a godrole with them.
    the thing with Kargash was he was not giving Mag anything at all! the first night we came in to meet him and we asked a few questions, got no answers and it was like, lets have a death challenge! well okay that appeals to mag and we did it! the next time, still real no interaction that I know of, and it was, go kill these mutant rats, oh you wanna challenge Celest okay! (that was fun at least though we really didn't get to see anything of that).

    Then the whole thing with the SoD happened, no Kargash to be seen. When he finally did we urged him to do something about it, totally Mag to want to see their god strike back against those who would do something against us! but no, instead he went after Gaudi which didn't sit well with a lot of us and we though he was an idiot for doing it, Gaudi is out ally. Then Kargash killed the Necromentate and Drochou (I think?) which further pushed the city away from him. We never got anything out of the relationship with him - oh ya, another death challenge! who was the better of the sexes! that point Ari as a character had had enough, she had participated, given without getting anything really in return except seeing allies attacked. Not saying Ari acted out though she did ask some hard questions that really should not have been for Kargash (oopse), but the things said were defiantly being thought!

    So from our perspective, he didn't play up to Mag other than offering us the challenges but he also didn't just like sit and talk I guess. I am not sure what else could have been done because I know the prying for answers to things was not something we were going to get. As for Arcanis, you may have liked it but right now I have people who want him removed from the city because of how he acted and somewhat continues to act to a point! :(

    note - this is just from my perspective and feelings on why things went down the way they did.
    The soft, hollow voice of Nocht, the Silent resounds within your mind as His words echo through the aether, "Congratulations, Arimisia. Your mastery of vermin cannot be disputed."

    image
  • ArcanisArcanis
    @Estarra I personally attempted to cool down the Hate on CT, but it seemed like that was the RP the mortals were expected to present. Time and again I tried to tell people "You know they can basically destroy you with a single hit right?" which would get the reply "I dont care". Although, truth be told, I had thought Magnagora was at first the least to be insulting...mostly because Karagash was just never around. From what I originally saw, Glomdoring immediately tossed Serane out. Serenwilde angered Luella to the point she committed mass-murder, and Gaudi...well, we can all see Subotai's insult.


    As I tried to explain to Karagash (whomever was playing him at the time) yesterday, Mag is a city with a culture based on Deeds. Like any warrior society-type, the fighters wont just follow someone that says "follow me". This person has to prove their strength, which I urged Karagash to do several times, by striking a blow against Mag's enemies. From the Magnagoran's point of view, all they saw was that an enemy (Celest's patron) had struck a blow against Magnagora by untainting the sea of Despair, and karagash, rather than try to strike back, actually praised Aelish for it. This caused a -huge- uproar, especially in a society like Magnagora.


    Ah well, guess it's all over now anyway.
  • ArcanisArcanis
    Arimisia said:


    So from our perspective, he didn't play up to Mag other than offering us the challenges but he also didn't just like sit and talk I guess. I am not sure what else could have been done because I know the prying for answers to things was not something we were going to get. As for Arcanis, you may have liked it but right now I have people who want him removed from the city because of how he acted and somewhat continues to act to a point! :(

    note - this is just from my perspective and feelings on why things went down the way they did.


    As I explained to my guild and city, Mag has (mostly) always kept up to the concept of "separation of religion and state". As has been said several times in Magnagora over the years: Your Order is Your business, dont get it involved, which is the same for Godly affairs. Magnagora is it's own entity, and frankly for someone hating on Elders, that doesnt approve for a reason to boot them. Frankly the people calling for me to be removed are literally on the basis "He was against the Elders and helping the Enemy", which frankly Arcanis has been against Elder gods for years now, but only now do people take notice. I've already had some on the council say they'd never agree to something like that, so im not worried, but meh.
  • DrocillaDrocilla
    edited December 2015
    Regarding the comments above I can tell you the other orgs had their bouts of defiance and then pretended to play nice. Celest had subversive and hilariously annotated paintings and Seren had vivid underground resistance, but they smiled to godly faces even when they didn't agree. From what you describe, you all defied Karagash and are not happy with how he was played. The other False Gods did not play to their org's likes either: Luella wanted to destroy even living beings, Sciomore wanted to incinerate things, Aelish declared himself the new and only Light. They were your oppressors, you were not meant to be happy with them.
  • ArcanisArcanis
    Welllllll truth be told, it got so bad with Sciomore that he blew up Hallifax.
  • ArixArix
    I say this again, Arix is old and jaded, of course he was going to call BS, Though his original assumption was wrong. But then again his assumption about the Seals may very well come true
  • LorinaLorina
    I had a blast with this one. I genuinely believed for a couple of minutes watching the world emotes about the first god and second dying as real. And then after the 3rd, I finally figured out it can't be real. Was legit freaking out! I got to stretch my legs and RP with people I do not normally get to outside of Celest. People thought I didn't play anymore until this event because I guess I never leave Celest. All in all, I rank this event as one of my all time favorites! All the way up there when that one time they released the plague with chocolate bunnies! Thanks guys, for a good event. THis was by far the most well orchestrated and over the top one yet.

  • ArimisiaArimisia
    I would also like to state that I did overall enjoy this event. I do not usually get involved in any of these events so to actually take part and be drawn in, staying up much later than I should have and trying to get out of work early so I could be on =^^=

    Thank you!
    The soft, hollow voice of Nocht, the Silent resounds within your mind as His words echo through the aether, "Congratulations, Arimisia. Your mastery of vermin cannot be disputed."

    image
  • ArixArix
    It was nice RPing with Hallifax, though it has made me once again want to orghop
This discussion has been closed.